KillTheCan.org Accountability Forum
Community => Introductions => Topic started by: Quitnow on January 17, 2009, 02:16:00 PM
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Tomorrow is my planned quit day. I'm freaking nervous. I've prepared by talking to a counselor, getting a 'quit nicotine' hotline phone number, getting rid of all my chew accessories, joining up here (tomorrow I will join the March 2009 group (unless I can't--see below), and starting a blog (http://chewquit.blogspot.com/) to help me stay accountable.
I chose tomorrow to quit as I will be very busy the next three days, which I know from experience are the hardest days to stay off the evil leaves, the tooth staining demon can. I just do better stopping when I am keeping busy.
I am not just nervous, but excited. I want this demon off my back. I need to remember a day at a time. I'm not quitting for good, but for today. (Well, at least tomorrow I'll be quitting for today :)).
I plan to use nicotine gum to take the edge off for the first month, and am not sure if that means I can't join a group here. If not, that's disappointing as I like this forum, but I should know now so I can find another interactive resource for the next month. I look at my chew addiction as having multiple dimensions. The biggest is the nicotine, clearly. Then there are all the habits that go along with the Skoal--the rush of buying a can. Busting open the can and putting in the dip. The spitting (gross, but I have come to like that for some reason). All the secondary crap that I am so attached to. Rather than give up all at the same time I want to get rid of those secondary habits and create a life context without them, but still with the nicotine monster on my back that I can give up independently. Yes, that means I'd still be hooked on nicotine so I have a 'phase withdrawal' scheduled for that.
At any rate, that's my plan, and if it is incompatible with joining one of the groups then I may come back in a month when I quit the gum (and I am under no illusions that will be trivial, even with all the chew-specific contextual aspects gone).
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Tomorrow is my planned quit day. I'm freaking nervous. I've prepared by talking to a counselor, getting a 'quit nicotine' hotline phone number, getting rid of all my chew accessories, joining up here (tomorrow I will join the March 2009 group (unless I can't--see below), and starting a blog (http://chewquit.blogspot.com/) to help me stay accountable.
I chose tomorrow to quit as I will be very busy the next three days, which I know from experience are the hardest days to stay off the evil leaves, the tooth staining demon can. I just do better stopping when I am keeping busy.
I am not just nervous, but excited. I want this demon off my back. I need to remember a day at a time. I'm not quitting for good, but for today. (Well, at least tomorrow I'll be quitting for today :)).
I plan to use nicotine gum to take the edge off for the first month, and am not sure if that means I can't join a group here. If not, that's disappointing as I like this forum, but I should know now so I can find another interactive resource for the next month. I look at my chew addiction as having multiple dimensions. The biggest is the nicotine, clearly. Then there are all the habits that go along with the Skoal--the rush of buying a can. Busting open the can and putting in the dip. The spitting (gross, but I have come to like that for some reason). All the secondary crap that I am so attached to. Rather than give up all at the same time I want to get rid of those secondary habits and create a life context without them, but still with the nicotine monster on my back that I can give up independently. Yes, that means I'd still be hooked on nicotine so I have a 'phase withdrawal' scheduled for that.
At any rate, that's my plan, and if it is incompatible with joining one of the groups then I may come back in a month when I quit the gum (and I am under no illusions that will be trivial, even with all the chew-specific contextual aspects gone).
Good decision on quitting, but nicotine gum isn't the way. There's only ONE way. Stop using tobacco and nicotine. THAT is quitting. Yes. One day at a time is the way we roll around here.
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Good decision on quitting, but nicotine gum isn't the way. There's only ONE way. Stop using tobacco and nicotine. THAT is quitting. Yes. One day at a time is the way we roll around here.
I think this forum isn't for me. Your way seems to have helped so congratulations and I hope you'll wish me well even if I am using a different strategy. I don't want to end up arguing with people as it is counterproductive when what I need is support for the program I am following.
Good day and good luck.
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I started my quit using a plan similar to yours: patches for about a month to "take the edge off". After 12 days on the patches, I posted a question similar to yours regarding posting roll call while on nicotine replacement, and got the advice to drop the nicotine replacement and go cold turkey. So... I said "fuck it" and went for it. I was scared shitless, but I haven't regretted it one bit.
I think the patches were a good idea, but only as a device to get started. I think a week is about right, then drop it. I don't think the nic gum is a good idea at all, as it doesn't do anything to break the up and down cycle of nicotine addiction.
One thing I thought was very helpful, both on the step from chew to patches and from patches to nothing, was starting a stopwatch and keeping it running. Any time I was going through a withdrawal or craving, I would look at the watch and say to myself "I have 18 hours done already (or 24, or 50, etc), I don't ever want to go through those hours again. Quitting will never be any easier than it is right now."
Do whatever it takes to get started, just GET STARTED and keep the shit out of your mouth. It's really not that bad once you really commit yourself to doing it. I only have six days off of the nicotine (18 days off of the chew) and I already feel better than I have in the past 12 years on a can-a-day-plus cope habit.
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To continue use of the drug which one is addicted to isn't quitting. Sorry.
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Hey, I didn't know Robert Fripp was in here! Love the avatar slug. I also agree. Cold Turkey. The rest is delaying the agony. Do it and get it over with.
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The reason all of those secondary characteristics have such meaning to you is because they were reinforced with the effects of the nicotine. Using the gum will just create a new "ritual". If you drop the nic then the reinforcement is gone and those other habits can go away. Or at least you can use fake chew, seeds, etc to fulfill them.
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So far so good. In middle of second day free of Skoal Demon. Major urges today when I went to a truck stop on the road with a huge layout of Skoal behind the counter. Mouth watering, but I was able to escape with just a candy bar.
I've found a place that is more congruent with my approach so this'll be my last visit here. Good luck and congrats to you all.
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I've found a place that is more congruent with my approach so this'll be my last visit here. Good luck and congrats to you all.
WEll quitnow may never read this post because he says this was his last visit but I want to extend him a good luck with his other group and if need be -- remember -- you really ain't left here so if need be come back. Rooster
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Just to say hi and I'm 43 days free of flavored cat shit in my mouth.
I'm almost weaned off the nicotine gum, too, as per my whole quit schedule.
For future reference: someone querying whether they can post in the quit groups here while using NRT you should tell them it is up to them, don't be jackass dogmatic fucks. The very first impression a newbie gets of this group could be life or death for that person.
If you look at the actual literature the NRT helps (on average), so I can't understand why anyone would discourage it. This is a site for quitting the chew isn't it?
As I said below:There are all the habits that go along with the Skoal--the rush of buying a can. Busting open the can and putting in the dip. The spitting (gross, but I have come to like that for some reason). All the secondary crap that I am so attached to. Rather than give up all at the same time as the nicotine I want to get rid of those secondary habits and create a life context without them, but still with the nicotine monster on my back that I can give up independently.
That nailed it. I couldn't say it better today.
Slug, your response was simply the wrong thing to say to a newbie. Not only was it factually incorrect, but its dogmatic inflexibility is an attitude that does not characterize recovery but childishness.
Thank god there are other resources I was able to use as I don't think I could have done it without a good support network.
I'm free of chew for 43 days, so obviously it has worked. If you knew me you'd know 43 days is something of a miracle, is saving my life. If you would disparage that because I initially kept some nicotine in my system, I would simply have to tell you to kindly fuck off.
A day at a time. I'm still struggling periodically with the urges, but overall things have evened out and my life is just better without the shit in my mouth.
And remember:
A hundred days is good. Today is better.
:)
OK, that's out of my system. I hope you handle these types of issues better in the future ya'll.
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Just to say hi and I'm 43 days free of flavored cat shit in my mouth.
I'm almost weaned off the nicotine gum, too, as per my whole quit schedule.
For future reference: someone querying whether they can post in the quit groups here while using NRT you should tell them it is up to them, don't be jackass dogmatic fucks. The very first impression a newbie gets of this group could be life or death for that person.
If you look at the actual literature the NRT helps (on average), so I can't understand why anyone would discourage it. This is a site for quitting the chew isn't it?
As I said below:There are all the habits that go along with the Skoal--the rush of buying a can. Busting open the can and putting in the dip. The spitting (gross, but I have come to like that for some reason). All the secondary crap that I am so attached to. Rather than give up all at the same time as the nicotine I want to get rid of those secondary habits and create a life context without them, but still with the nicotine monster on my back that I can give up independently.
That nailed it. I couldn't say it better today.
Slug, your response was simply the wrong thing to say to a newbie. Not only was it factually incorrect, but its dogmatic inflexibility is an attitude that does not characterize recovery but childishness.
Thank god there are other resources I was able to use as I don't think I could have done it without a good support network.
I'm free of chew for 43 days, so obviously it has worked. If you knew me you'd know 43 days is something of a miracle, is saving my life. If you would disparage that because I initially kept some nicotine in my system, I would simply have to tell you to kindly fuck off.
A day at a time. I'm still struggling periodically with the urges, but overall things have evened out and my life is just better without the shit in my mouth.
And remember:
A hundred days is good. Today is better.
:)
OK, that's out of my system. I hope you handle these types of issues better in the future ya'll.
Congrats on lowering your nicotene intake. Come on back and post a day one when you are ready to leave your crutch behind.
We will support and embrace you when you are quit.
Quit = No Nicotene
You have essentially wasted 43 days because your still at day 0 in my book.
Again I wish you the best in conquering this addiction, but I dont agree that NRT is a viable solution.
So come back next time when your clean and post a day 1.
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On January 17th you wrote......
At any rate, that's my plan, and if it is incompatible with joining one of the groups then I may come back in a month when I quit the gum (and I am under no illusions that will be trivial, even with all the chew-specific contextual aspects gone).
Today you wrote......
I'm almost weaned off the nicotine gum, too, as per my whole quit schedule.
43 day month hmmmmm? This is the problem i have with NRT's....first of all, personally, i have tried them all and none of them worked for me.....not to say it will not work for you or anyone else...but by your own admission you implicated yourself in utilizing this delivery system.....you moved your original plan by convincing yourself that WOW....i'm doing really well on this and at least it isn't dip and therefore a lot better for me...i will extend my use of this product for just a little while longer.....
You are addicted to Nicotine....no matter how you ingest it into your body, until you are nicotine free...you are not quit.......The ONLY way a NRT is ok in my mind is with a non-compromising cessation program based on time of day...not as a response to craves along with an identified and non-negotiable total cessation date.
From what you've said yourself......you would post a day 1 on our site....
If this post pisses you off.....you may want to ask yourself if the guilt of realizing you are still feeding your addiction isn't a primary contributing factor.
I will be glad to help you quit any way i can......when you quit.
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You are addicted to Nicotine....no matter how you ingest it into your body, until you are nicotine free...you are not quit.......The ONLY way a NRT is ok in my mind is with a non-compromising cessation program based on time of day...not as a response to craves along with an identified and non-negotiable total cessation date.
If this post pisses you off.....you may want to ask yourself if the guilt of realizing you are still feeding your addiction isn't a primary contributing factor. Â
I will be glad to help you quit any way i can......when you quit.
I have quit chewing, my primary goal. Just to clarify the semantics of the English language for those of you that need help with elementary logic: if I chewed ten pieces of nic gum a day, I would still have quit dipping. That I chew about a quarter of a piece of gum twice a day isn't important to me frankly, and I am on plan.
That you would try to use what I said on day 1 so literally and inflexibly in a kind of "gotcha" way is not surprising. Rather than congratulate me on my accomplishment, you try to demean me and play little games with my words. To spell out my plan more: At day 30 I cut the gum in half, then a week later cut it in half again, and in two weeks the plan is to cut it out.
If it works for you to not use the NRT, that is great, but to act like yours is the only way, that people like me doing something different haven't accomplished something, that we haven't actually quit chewing? That is myopic, factually incorrect, judgmental, arrogant, and frankly I would find it laughable if it didn't put people's lives at risk that come to this site looking for the full suite of options open to them.
As I said, if you look at the science (rather than anecdotes and dogma), you will see that people who use NRT have a 50% better permanent quit rate (that means off the NRT) than people who use nothing.
However, your site is your site, and if you want to be like the creationists of quitting chewing tobacco, then that is your right. I am only a little surprised to get defensive, belittling, and touchy reactions here, very much the opposite I expect from people in recovery. But I guess you are rounding up the wagons so it's to be expected.
I'm sure you'll be able to pacify each other against my lone voice that you are in the right, that I am somehow deluded, you can continue to belittle what I have accomplished and tell me to post day 1. Have fun with that, I hope it makes you feel self actualized and manly.
Good luck staying off the dip, and I pray that nobody dies of oral cancer because they got preachy dogmatic arrogance from coming here.
At any rate, anyone out there reading this : know that there is more than one way, there is not only one way to quit. Talk to therapists, doctors, and other people online if you want a more synoptic, balanced, and objective perspective. The world is bigger than people here seem to realize. Don't take my word for it, do some research.
Best,
Quitnow
Proud to be 43 Days Free of the Dip
May God help us see the truth, whatever that may be.
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Hey quitnow....what is your motivation for coming in here today and telling us all of this?
I tried NRT by the plan. It just didn't work for me. So, rather than dip (hey, at least I wasn't dipping...), I decided to use it as a crutch. I kept using it for almost 2 years. What did NRT do for me? It made it that much easier to switch back to the real thing (dip) when a period of heavy stress hit me. And that happened. So, I was back to the can-o-day of Cope. Then, I started NRT again back on Sept 5. I found KTC at the end of Sept. I caught shit for the NRT. So, I went cold turkey. Well, that worked for me.
I think that as long as we have nicotine in our systems, it just draws out the agony. There is no magic pill or gum that takes away the suck. You will feel the suck during your first 3 non-nicotine days after quitting NRT just as much as you would going off dip straight out. The suck is the suck....and it's going to suck.
So, quit being a wimp and throw that gum or whatever you're using into the trash. Why suffer and pay money for something that isn't going to help you? You're going to feel like crap the first 3 days after quitting it anyway. Then, you have the same cycle of quit funks that anyone has after that. I still have craves, and I've been off nicotine and tobacco for 145 days.
This site helps not only in the beginning (where you are at), but it also helps way on down the road. I'm still in the early part of the road, but I got some quitters up in front of me that I talk to each day that tell me what the traffic is like further on down that road.
You can come in here and talk at us, you you can come in here and quit with us. It's your choice. We'll be here tomorrow.
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My motivation was to tell you that by telling people using NRT isn't really quitting could be sending newbies back out there, that it is not only untrue but positively harmful.
Here's an example research paper: "All of the commercially available forms of NRT (gum, transdermal patch, nasal spray, inhaler and sublingual tablets/lozenges) can help people who make a quit attempt to increase their chances of successfully stopping smoking. NRTs increase the rate of quitting by 50-70%, regardless of setting. "
Reference:
http://mrw.interscience.wiley.com/cochr ... frame.html (http://mrw.interscience.wiley.com/cochrane/clsysrev/articles/CD000146/frame.html)
The data are clear on this. People who use NRT are much more likely to quit. Period.
To tell people they aren't really quit if they use NRT, when in fact NRT has been shown to make them much more likely to quit in the long run, is not an innocuous innacuracy. At a site like this the so-called "oldtimers" should know the facts, not just spit out dogma based on some of their personal anecdotes.
At any rate, good luck to you all. I would hope you would wish me well in my own recovery from the horrible cat turds I put in my mouth.
I have a group I go to, and couldn't have done this without them.
Again, not here to start a war and I apologize for coming off a bit too strong, but it really concerns me that you may be sending people back out there to die.
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My motivation was to tell you that by telling people using NRT isn't really quitting could be sending newbies back out there, that it is not only untrue but positively harmful.
Here's an example research paper: "All of the commercially available forms of NRT (gum, transdermal patch, nasal spray, inhaler and sublingual tablets/lozenges) can help people who make a quit attempt to increase their chances of successfully stopping smoking. NRTs increase the rate of quitting by 50-70%, regardless of setting. "
Reference:
http://mrw.interscience.wiley.com/cochr ... frame.html (http://mrw.interscience.wiley.com/cochrane/clsysrev/articles/CD000146/frame.html)
The data are clear on this. People who use NRT are much more likely to quit. Period.
To tell people they aren't really quit if they use NRT, when in fact NRT has been shown to make them much more likely to quit in the long run, is not an innocuous innacuracy. At a site like this the so-called "oldtimers" should know the facts, not just spit out dogma based on some of their personal anecdotes.
At any rate, good luck to you all. I would hope you would wish me well in my own recovery from the horrible cat turds I put in my mouth.
I have a group I go to, and couldn't have done this without them.
Again, not here to start a war and I apologize for coming off a bit too strong, but it really concerns me that you may be sending people back out there to die.
Best of luck to you....based on the experience of myself and a large number of quitters i have met on this site, my own research is that NRT's have not resulted in very many successful quits WITHOUT a very defined ingestion regime and strictly adhered to reduction dates.
My point in taking time to respond to you was if you are using NRT's on demand in direct response to a crave....you are just feeding your nicotine addiction via a new delivery system. I have seen in my own life that it was really easy to use the argument that "this is ok, because it is not chew...." and extend anticipated cutback and cessation dates.
gotta call Bullshit on that argument.....again, you are still under the control of your addiction to nicotine instead of empowering yourself to truly quit.
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Cut this post I accidentally replicated it.
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I have seen in my own life that it was really easy to use the argument that "this is ok, because it is not chew...."Â and extend anticipated cutback and cessation dates.
gotta call Bullshit on that argument.....again, you are still under the control of your addiction to nicotine instead of empowering yourself to truly quit.
One person's bullshit is another's fertilizer, I guess. Some people chew that fake dip, and I look at that as odd and suspect and continuing many aspects of the addiction. But many here seem to look at that as OK. I, on the other hand, am doing the opposite. They get rid of the nicotine but nothing else. I get rid of everything but the nicotine.
My sole goal was to get off the dip. I needed to for serious health reasons, urgently. I didn't care if I had to use the gum for the rest of my life (the health problems that come with using the gum are real, but dwarfed by the actual dip).
Luckily I hooked up with a good group, and a therapist dude, who have been very helpful. Without them I couldn't have quit the dip.
They convinced me, before I quit, to stage down my gum use. I think this is a perfectly reasonable and good thing to do, and I am doing it (my new addiction is normal gum, I'm chewing it all the fucking time). Frankly, I haven't really had to try to stop using the gum. It's happened naturally I just use less and chew more regular gum.
There are a million ways to quit. Regardless of anecdotes, if you look at evidence based on hundreds of people in double-blind research trials (in which neither the researcher nor the subject knows if they have the NRT or placebo), there is an unequivocal benefit (defined as quitting for 12 months) in using NRT compared to placebo.
Groups like this also help. I'm combining them and have had great success, by my definition.
Obviously our definitions differ, but for people here to shoehorn me into their narrow picture of quitting, and judge me negatively based on that myopia, is what I would call bullshit on.
A'ight enough for me for now. I hope nobody dies because there are assholes here. My hunch is many people will LIVE because of the assholes here. Hopefully more in the latter group than the former. Hell, AA works and it is full of incredibly dogmatic assholes and is underwritten by a kooky program of steps and such, and it manages to help people.
Plus, if someone were to use people here as an excuse to not quit, then they may not be ready to quit. I didn't let you fuckers stop me, I found other resources where people were more reasonable, and I knew such resources had to exist as as I knew I was being perfectly reasonable in my approach. :)
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One person's bullshit is another's fertilizer, I guess. Some people chew that fake dip, and I look at that as odd and suspect and continuing many aspects of the addiction. But many here seem to look at that as OK. I, on the other hand, am doing the opposite. They get rid of the nicotine but nothing else. I get rid of everything but the nicotine.
you do realize this is a nicotine cessation site don't you?.......
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And just to be clear quitnow, nobody here on this site is putting lip turds into other people's mouths. Heaven forbid that someone dies from dipping, but if they do, they can look to their own hand as it was stuffing it in that lip.
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I've been quit for a little over two weeks now, and I did it cold turkey. I have tried to quit in the past several times using patches, pills, and gum. Each time I relapsed after a week. While there are other HABITS associated with dipping, the ADDICTION is to the nicotine. The first 3 days suck dude. After that, it gets better. No one is saying you can't quit with NRTs, but I can tell you from experience that it is easier to relapse if you go that route.
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you do realize this is a nicotine cessation site don't you?.......
I was under the impression that it was a site for quitting chewing tobacco. Maybe the whole "kill the can: a resource to quit dip, snuff, and chewing tobacco" name mislead me into thinking that.
And I have quit chewing. Of course I'm also weaning off the nic gum as I planned, but frankly I don't even care about that. It's a secondary goal, just as many here probably have to wean off that fake snuff crap that they use to continue all the parts of their chew addiction except the nicotine.
As I said, if someone goes back to chewing because of ignorant assholes at this site, that says as much about them as it does about people here. But don't let that salve your conscience: If you are telling people that cold turkey is the only way for anyone to quit chewing, that NRT isn't a real quit, then your are spreading pernicious misinformation.
As I said, don't take my word for it. Look up the statistics on this in the medical journals at pubmed, you will see that NRT users are more successful at staying off the cat turds. Of course at this site there will be a selection effect: because you belittle people that would use NRT, nobody at this site uses NRT, so of course you see the experienced members and such saying how NRT is bullshit. That doesn't mean anything. That's like saying prayer helps alcoholism because the oldtimers at AA all pray.
For those that like to use their experience as an argument for everyone, I can say I've quit cold turkey before, and obviously it didn't work. I did it many times. This time I used NRT and it worked. I have stopped the chew. Therefore, obviously cold turkey doesn't work and everyone should use NRT.
Silly argument, eh?
Quitnow
Proud to be 44 days off the dip
One day at a time
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you do realize this is a nicotine cessation site don't you?.......
I was under the impression that it was a site for quitting chewing tobacco. Maybe the whole "kill the can: a resource to quit dip, snuff, and chewing tobacco" name mislead me into thinking that.
And I have quit chewing. Of course I'm also weaning off the nic gum as I planned, but frankly I don't even care about that. It's a secondary goal, just as many here probably have to wean off that fake snuff crap that they use to continue all the parts of their chew addiction except the nicotine.
As I said, if someone goes back to chewing because of ignorant assholes at this site, that says as much about them as it does about people here. But don't let that salve your conscience: If you are telling people that cold turkey is the only way for anyone to quit chewing, that NRT isn't a real quit, then your are spreading pernicious misinformation.
Quitnow
Proud to be 44 days off the dip
One day at a time
didn't say that at all. re-read my posts.....and while our name is "Kill The Can"....this site is about addiction to nicotine.....period.
I ingested nicotine in one form or another for almost 30 years.......and i have done so with every delivery system.....never cared for smoking but would do so to keep from dipping....was i quit? no...i was just taking the bus to the same destination. I've tried the patch, gum and lozenges.....and while i may not have been packing cope in my lip.....i was just taking a plane, taxi or train to the same destination.......feeding my nicotine habit.
I will state again....
If you are using the nrt on a regimented schedule......it is one way to quit.....my definition of "regimented schedule" is based on a time of day delivery NOT "i'm jonesin and cravin so let me pop a piece of nicorette".
If it works for you great....thrilled your quit by your definition. I just disagree with changing delivery systems and calling yourself quit based on our site's goal of assisting people in their nicotine addiction battle.
If you think this site is about just "not dipping"....you really need to spend some more time reading and less time trying to find a "round-about" way to justify your program both to yourself and me........
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you do realize this is a nicotine cessation site don't you?.......
I was under the impression that it was a site for quitting chewing tobacco. Maybe the whole "kill the can: a resource to quit dip, snuff, and chewing tobacco" name mislead me into thinking that.
And I have quit chewing. Of course I'm also weaning off the nic gum as I planned, but frankly I don't even care about that. It's a secondary goal, just as many here probably have to wean off that fake snuff crap that they use to continue all the parts of their chew addiction except the nicotine.
As I said, if someone goes back to chewing because of ignorant assholes at this site, that says as much about them as it does about people here. But don't let that salve your conscience: If you are telling people that cold turkey is the only way for anyone to quit chewing, that NRT isn't a real quit, then your are spreading pernicious misinformation.
Quitnow
Proud to be 44 days off the dip
One day at a time
didn't say that at all. re-read my posts.....and while our name is "Kill The Can"....this site is about addiction to nicotine.....period.
I ingested nicotine in one form or another for almost 30 years.......and i have done so with every delivery system.....never cared for smoking but would do so to keep from dipping....was i quit? no...i was just taking the bus to the same destination. I've tried the patch, gum and lozenges.....and while i may not have been packing cope in my lip.....i was just taking a plane, taxi or train to the same destination.......feeding my nicotine habit.
I will state again....
If you are using the nrt on a regimented schedule......it is one way to quit.....my definition of "regimented schedule" is based on a time of day delivery NOT "i'm jonesin and cravin so let me pop a piece of nicorette".
If it works for you great....thrilled your quit by your definition. I just disagree with changing delivery systems and calling yourself quit based on our site's goal of assisting people in their nicotine addiction battle.
If you think this site is about just "not dipping"....you really need to spend some more time reading and less time trying to find a "round-about" way to justify your program both to yourself and me........
maybe this site would be better suited for your needs
http://www.quitsmokeless.org/ (http://www.quitsmokeless.org/)
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maybe this site would be better suited for your needs
http://www.quitsmokeless.org/ (http://www.quitsmokeless.org/)
Them's my boys.
At any rate, I am not arguing that nicotine isn't the main physically addictive component of chew that we know of, and of course it is a bad idea to ingest nicotine in the long term.
For instance, one study concludes: "These findings suggest that nicotine is the major constituent in cigarette smoke that leads to insulin resistance, metabolic abnormalities associated with the insulin resistance syndrome, and increased cardiovascular morbidity. Thus, the use of nicotine replacement therapy during smoking cessation should be transient and limited."
From this study:
http://www.circ.ahajournals.org/cgi/con ... t/94/5/878 (http://www.circ.ahajournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/94/5/878)
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First off, congratulations on 44 days without dip.
Second, you are right, we are a bunch of assholes, but let's be clear...nicotine free assholes.
Third, when you decide that you've used your last piece of nico-gum, come back and let us know how those first few hours and days are going.
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From the KTC mission statement:
This site and community are designed to help people quit using smokeless tobacco. This includes all brands types of chew, dip, snuff spit tobacco.
We will NOT tell you that one way is better than another, but we will tell you our experience and what has worked for us.
Although this is a website dedicated to quitting smokeless tobacco, we understand our addiction centers around nicotine. Therefore the smoking of cigarettes, cigars or pipes is not acceptable to us during our smokeless tobacco quit.
Both sides need to chill.
Hey quitnow, congrats on being dip free. Nicotine is still dangerous, so good luck with kicking that habit next. Seems like you're on your way.
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From the KTC mission statement:
This site and community are designed to help people quit using smokeless tobacco. This includes all brands types of chew, dip, snuff spit tobacco.
We will NOT tell you that one way is better than another, but we will tell you our experience and what has worked for us.
Although this is a website dedicated to quitting smokeless tobacco, we understand our addiction centers around nicotine. Therefore the smoking of cigarettes, cigars or pipes is not acceptable to us during our smokeless tobacco quit.
Both sides need to chill.
Hey quitnow, congrats on being dip free. Nicotine is still dangerous, so good luck with kicking that habit next. Seems like you're on your way.
Actually the entire quote reads:
We realize that there are a variety of ways to be successful quitting chew. We will NOT tell you that one way is better than another, but we will tell you our experience and what has worked for us. We will also tell you when you are doing something counterproductive to your quit. This quit is for you and about you. We are simply here to aid you along your journey. If you need "tough love" we will give that. If you need encouragement we will give that. If you need to be scared into quitting we will do that.
-
From the KTC mission statement:
This site and community are designed to help people quit using smokeless tobacco. This includes all brands types of chew, dip, snuff spit tobacco.
We will NOT tell you that one way is better than another, but we will tell you our experience and what has worked for us.
Although this is a website dedicated to quitting smokeless tobacco, we understand our addiction centers around nicotine. Therefore the smoking of cigarettes, cigars or pipes is not acceptable to us during our smokeless tobacco quit.
Both sides need to chill.
Hey quitnow, congrats on being dip free. Nicotine is still dangerous, so good luck with kicking that habit next. Seems like you're on your way.
Actually the entire quote reads:
We realize that there are a variety of ways to be successful quitting chew. We will NOT tell you that one way is better than another, but we will tell you our experience and what has worked for us. We will also tell you when you are doing something counterproductive to your quit. This quit is for you and about you. We are simply here to aid you along your journey. If you need "tough love" we will give that. If you need encouragement we will give that. If you need to be scared into quitting we will do that.
Kind of contradictory, no?
I could care less either way. I'm not dipping and it had very little to do with this message board. Support is one thing, but "tough love" is something reserved for people you actually know.
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From the KTC mission statement:
This site and community are designed to help people quit using smokeless tobacco. This includes all brands types of chew, dip, snuff spit tobacco.
We will NOT tell you that one way is better than another, but we will tell you our experience and what has worked for us.
Although this is a website dedicated to quitting smokeless tobacco, we understand our addiction centers around nicotine. Therefore the smoking of cigarettes, cigars or pipes is not acceptable to us during our smokeless tobacco quit.
Both sides need to chill.
Hey quitnow, congrats on being dip free. Nicotine is still dangerous, so good luck with kicking that habit next. Seems like you're on your way.
Actually the entire quote reads:
We realize that there are a variety of ways to be successful quitting chew. We will NOT tell you that one way is better than another, but we will tell you our experience and what has worked for us. We will also tell you when you are doing something counterproductive to your quit. This quit is for you and about you. We are simply here to aid you along your journey. If you need "tough love" we will give that. If you need encouragement we will give that. If you need to be scared into quitting we will do that.
Kind of contradictory, no?
I could care less either way. I'm not dipping and it had very little to do with this message board. Support is one thing, but "tough love" is something reserved for people you actually know.
I do have to ask Quitnow. I've been reading this and I'm confused.
You quit dipping, but are using Nicotine gum or patches right?
But you care more about stopping chewing thatn quitting nocotine? Am I following you right?
Or are you saying that you are going to quit putting shit in your mouth first, then stop the nicotine flow after you've beaten the putting the shit in your mouth.
Right?
What will stop you after you quit the nicotine part from going back and putting the shit in your mouth?
What will stop you when you quit the nicotine part from, well, chewing nicotine gum?
So i'm just confused on what you're trying to accomplish.
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From the KTC mission statement:
This site and community are designed to help people quit using smokeless tobacco. This includes all brands types of chew, dip, snuff spit tobacco.
We will NOT tell you that one way is better than another, but we will tell you our experience and what has worked for us.
Although this is a website dedicated to quitting smokeless tobacco, we understand our addiction centers around nicotine. Therefore the smoking of cigarettes, cigars or pipes is not acceptable to us during our smokeless tobacco quit.
Both sides need to chill.
Hey quitnow, congrats on being dip free. Nicotine is still dangerous, so good luck with kicking that habit next. Seems like you're on your way.
Actually the entire quote reads:
We realize that there are a variety of ways to be successful quitting chew. We will NOT tell you that one way is better than another, but we will tell you our experience and what has worked for us. We will also tell you when you are doing something counterproductive to your quit. This quit is for you and about you. We are simply here to aid you along your journey. If you need "tough love" we will give that. If you need encouragement we will give that. If you need to be scared into quitting we will do that.
Kind of contradictory, no?
I could care less either way. I'm not dipping and it had very little to do with this message board. Support is one thing, but "tough love" is something reserved for people you actually know.
First of all.....thanks as this has helped me pass the time on yet another monday..lol
If you'll notice...i didn't highligh tough love.....i highlighted the part about sharing our experiences, what has worked for me and if based on that experience we see anything counterproductive to your quit......
Read my posts......all i did was point out that if you are using NRT's in a defined scheduled manner as per the instructions.....fine.
When you pop a piece of nic gum to satisty a crave all you are doing is chewing gum instead of packing a dip....both of which are feeding your main problem which is a nicotine addiction. When you change your defined schedule....you are giving back any control you may have over your addiction back to nicotine......which is clearly the situation here.
That is clearly counterproductive to anyone's quit.......
Bottom line is this, there is no magic cure, pill or method to quit this shit. It is gonna sting like hell...I have had unsuccessful cold turkey quits on my own as well....i have one helluva successful cold turkey quit with this board.
Snatch the band-aid off and get involved with a board that holds you accountable as this board does instead of peeling that sumbitch off slow.....NRT's just prolong the addiction and lengthen the overall withdrawal process.....period.
why not just quit.....
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Same here. This is keeping me from writing a paper (haha).
I'm all for the cold turkey quit. I'm at 15 days right now. I just don't think people need to get in quitnow's face for saying that his plan involves nicotine gum. There's a bit more than "sharing experiences" going on in some of the posts.
I think the #1 goal for everyone posting on this board is to quit dipping.
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I don't think it is constructive for anybody to be involved in a pissing contest about how to quit properly. My understanding of this community is that NRT's are okay as long as they are used as directed and not abused. There isn't a lot of confusion regarding this rule, follow the NRT program to the letter or you are not meeting this communities' standard for quit.
A lot of people here are not in favor of using NRT's. I personally have never tried any of them. I can see the benefits of cold turkey quitting, but I also could understand why you would want to attempt to avoid the full force of those physical withdrawal symptoms. I am pretty sure there are a lot of people who have quit both ways.
If somebody asked me what I would reccomend, I would tell them to set aside 72 hours in which you didn't have much else to do and just power through it. That was my experience. I literally stayed in bed or on the KTC site the entire time. On day 4 I felt pretty decent.
The bottom line is don't try and discredit somebody's experience just because it isn't your own. If you find yourself abusing an NRT as opposed to using it properly than I would suggest you try cold turkey and post a day 1. If you are following an NRT program as directed with the goal of becoming nic free than congratulations on your quit.
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I don't think it is constructive for anybody to be involved in a pissing contest about how to quit properly. My understanding of this community is that NRT's are okay as long as they are used as directed and not abused. There isn't a lot of confusion regarding this rule, follow the NRT program to the letter or you are not meeting this communities' standard for quit.
A lot of people here are not in favor of using NRT's. I personally have never tried any of them. I can see the benefits of cold turkey quitting, but I also could understand why you would want to attempt to avoid the full force of those physical withdrawal symptoms. I am pretty sure there are a lot of people who have quit both ways.
If somebody asked me what I would reccomend, I would tell them to set aside 72 hours in which you didn't have much else to do and just power through it. That was my experience. I literally stayed in bed or on the KTC site the entire time. On day 4 I felt pretty decent.
The bottom line is don't try and discredit somebody's experience just because it isn't your own. If you find yourself abusing an NRT as opposed to using it properly than I would suggest you try cold turkey and post a day 1. If you are following an NRT program as directed with the goal of becoming nic free than congratulations on your quit.
i've actually viewed the past coupla days posts as good natured debate. I do think your posts sums it up nicely ray and i agree with your evaluation.
To me, Kill the Can is my NRT....and all that goes with it......posting roll, keeping my word, learning from those ahead, helping those behind, being entertained and attempting to entertain on occasion, the satisfaction of being a small part of something much larger than any individual on here with the common goal of helping people with an ugly and deadly addiction etc...etc...etc......
And the good thing about my NRT is.....when used properly, i will never cave.
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The reason all of those secondary characteristics have such meaning to you is because they were reinforced with the effects of the nicotine. Using the gum will just create a new "ritual". If you drop the nic then the reinforcement is gone and those other habits can go away. Or at least you can use fake chew, seeds, etc to fulfill them.
Agree 100% with that comment justquit... Great post!
quit, one day at a time. Step by step. And, while you are quitting find new habits. Is it easy??? Hell no. If it were easy, everyone would be quittin. Take ur first step homie.... and watch all those years come back to your life. I don't know about you but I kind of like breathing. For that reason, the logic behind quitting was a friggin no brainer.
Giddy-up
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Good discussion here. I came off a bit strong, got pretty defensive. Thanks raymwiii for injecting reason into this thread.
Just dropping in to say that getting off the nic gum was pretty easy. Compared to quitting the dip, it was a total cakewalk. I still have urges for both sometimes, frankly, but the difficulty level of stopping the gum can't compare to stopping putting the cat turds of death in my mouth.
I kept cutting the gum in half every week until I was taking tiny little nibbles, and then substituted in normal bubble gum, and now that's what I chew all the time when I have an urge.
I don't know how you guys do cold turkey, but I'm glad I didn't. It was hard enough for me to give up all the auxilliary habits that went with the Skoal. I couldn't have done it without the nic gum (believe me, I tried many many fucking times...).
I've done a lot of research on this topic, partly spurred by this thread. The research shows that NRT helps (very significantly, like 2-4 times more likely to be quit in one year), with one exeption. Those who use it for more than 12 months are just as likely as non NRT users to be back on the shit within two years. Hence, everyone here saying to have a plan to get off NRT is right, but there is no catastrophe if it takes you 6 months or so.
NRT is a lot healthier than chewing tobacco, but nicotine still ain't exactly healthy (the results here are mixed, though--increased risk for heart disease with nicotine, but strongly decreased risk for Parkinson's and Alzheimers for nicotine use).
From a CNN article (note it focuses on smoking not chewing but whatever):
"Nicotine replacement therapies -- the patch or gum -- are safe and highly successful to help quit smoking. Tobacco smoke causes nearly 90 percent of lung cancer deaths, according to the American Cancer Society. "If it is a choice between smoking tobacco product or a nicotine replacement -- of course, keep taking the nicotine," Schroeder [physician and smoking cessation expert at the University of California-San Francisco Medical Center] said. "It is a heck of a lot healthier than tobacco smoking."
At some point I will write up a fairly extensive literature review, and post a link to it here.
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I've got 156 days off the cat turds. Not sure how long off the NRT, something like 100 days but frankly I don't keep track of that. It was so easy to get off compared to the dip it doesn't feel worthy of my attention.
From the American Cancer Society page on smokeless tobacco, they have some bits on NRT:
http://www.cancer.org/docroot/PED/conte ... obacco.asp (http://www.cancer.org/docroot/PED/contentPED_10_13X_Quitting_Smokeless_Tobacco.asp)
Have fun being quit ya'll. Thanks for nothing. 'Finger'
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I've got 156 days off the cat turds. Not sure how long off the NRT, something like 100 days but frankly I don't keep track of that. It was so easy to get off compared to the dip it doesn't feel worthy of my attention.
From the American Cancer Society page on smokeless tobacco, they have some bits on NRT:
http://www.cancer.org/docroot/PED/conte ... obacco.asp (http://www.cancer.org/docroot/PED/contentPED_10_13X_Quitting_Smokeless_Tobacco.asp)
Have fun being quit ya'll. Thanks for nothing. 'Finger'
Congrats quitnow. I read through your entire intro page right now and see that you initiated some very interesting debate and strong feelings from some of the quitters here. For that, this community owes you a bit of thanks. Anything that takes our mind off of urges is productive.
One point I would like to make, in an effort to support you - I highly suggest you use the strongest aspect of this site which is posting roll. Whatever a person's take on NRT, you are now officially clear of nicotine in all shapes and forms. Join the proper group for 156 days quit - April 2009 (http://forum.killthecan.org/index.php?showtopic=2015) - one of the tightest group of quitters to come through this community. Post a day 157 tomorrow. Introduce yourself. If you already have another support group that will continue on now that you are far into your quit, that's great. If not, protect your quit with the support of others. It only takes a minute to post roll every morning. Make it a ritual.
I "quit" for nearly a year at one point a few years back. I found this site during that time but thought that the people were fucking idiots - bitching and fighting over nothing. I never joined a quit group. It only took one moment of weakness and I was back to a can a day. Now, with the support I have found with the people on this website, repeating that decision is not an option. I will do something else. I will remain quit.
Congrats on 156 or 1--? However someone chooses to judge your methods, you've taken a huge step for yourself. It is just a step. Do whatever it takes to keep the quit.
-Dave
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Thanks for nothing.
Do you know where I can get into an alcohol-replacement therapy program? I just want to get a little bit drunk every day.
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Thanks for nothing.
Do you know where I can get into an alcohol-replacement therapy program? I just want to get a little bit drunk every day.
LMAO!!
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Thanks for nothing.
Do you know where I can get into an alcohol-replacement therapy program? I just want to get a little bit drunk every day.
LMAO!!
tiffs8.978
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I've got 156 days off the cat turds. Not sure how long off the NRT, something like 100 days but frankly I don't keep track of that. It was so easy to get off compared to the dip it doesn't feel worthy of my attention.
From the American Cancer Society page on smokeless tobacco, they have some bits on NRT:
http://www.cancer.org/docroot/PED/conte ... obacco.asp (http://www.cancer.org/docroot/PED/contentPED_10_13X_Quitting_Smokeless_Tobacco.asp)
Have fun being quit ya'll. Thanks for nothing. 'Finger'
Congrats quitnow. I read through your entire intro page right now and see that you initiated some very interesting debate and strong feelings from some of the quitters here. For that, this community owes you a bit of thanks. Anything that takes our mind off of urges is productive.
One point I would like to make, in an effort to support you - I highly suggest you use the strongest aspect of this site which is posting roll. Whatever a person's take on NRT, you are now officially clear of nicotine in all shapes and forms. Join the proper group for 156 days quit - April 2009 (http://forum.killthecan.org/index.php?showtopic=2015) - one of the tightest group of quitters to come through this community. Post a day 157 tomorrow. Introduce yourself. If you already have another support group that will continue on now that you are far into your quit, that's great. If not, protect your quit with the support of others. It only takes a minute to post roll every morning. Make it a ritual.
I "quit" for nearly a year at one point a few years back. I found this site during that time but thought that the people were fucking idiots - bitching and fighting over nothing. I never joined a quit group. It only took one moment of weakness and I was back to a can a day. Now, with the support I have found with the people on this website, repeating that decision is not an option. I will do something else. I will remain quit.
Congrats on 156 or 1--? However someone chooses to judge your methods, you've taken a huge step for yourself. It is just a step. Do whatever it takes to keep the quit.
-Dave
Aww, you had to go and take my asshole post and respond with respect, intelligence, and candor? Seriously, you are a bigger man than I for doing that. The others I was able to drag down to my level, which is standard for the interwebs.
Seriously, though, I hope the rigidity here doesn't hurt the noob. People come here as their first glimpse of what a quit is like. If they happen to come here rather than the American Cancer Society, the various organs of the American Medical Association, and other informed communities of professionals, then they will get bad information. I hope they don't leave with the wrong idea, that quitting with the help of NRTs is not really quitting, that they might as well continue to dip if they feel they can't without the NRT (which I couldn't as I tried many times).
So, good luck, and I hope nobody dies because of this misinformation. Go ahead and make fun of me, but I'm not kidding. To me quitting dip wasn't a joke, but a serious matter.
With the exception of two people who posted here (smokeyg and raymwiii), people here were pretty much just waving their cocks around and full of crap jerking each other off circling the wagons. Again, I hope nobody dies because of the ignorance here.
OK, you are done with me and vice-versa. I wished to use your group, I would have been a good member of the April 2009 quit class, but you rebuffed me. Thank goodness I found other resources, and succeeded despite your misinformation.
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Again, I hope nobody dies because of the ignorance here.
Thank goodness I found other resources, and succeeded despite your misinformation.
No one here is ignorant, sir. This Web resource is dedicated to *quitting nicotine*...not quitting the habit of putting shredded tobacco in our mouths, which is merely a delivery system.
And you weren't even remotely misinformed. Your own first post attests to that. You knew goddamn well what this site is all about: quitting nicotine. NRT is great for some. But while on such a program, you are NOT quit.
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I've got 156 days off the cat turds. Not sure how long off the NRT, something like 100 days but frankly I don't keep track of that. It was so easy to get off compared to the dip it doesn't feel worthy of my attention.
From the American Cancer Society page on smokeless tobacco, they have some bits on NRT:
http://www.cancer.org/docroot/PED/conte ... obacco.asp (http://www.cancer.org/docroot/PED/contentPED_10_13X_Quitting_Smokeless_Tobacco.asp)
Have fun being quit ya'll. Thanks for nothing. 'Finger'
Congrats quitnow. I read through your entire intro page right now and see that you initiated some very interesting debate and strong feelings from some of the quitters here. For that, this community owes you a bit of thanks. Anything that takes our mind off of urges is productive.
One point I would like to make, in an effort to support you - I highly suggest you use the strongest aspect of this site which is posting roll. Whatever a person's take on NRT, you are now officially clear of nicotine in all shapes and forms. Join the proper group for 156 days quit - April 2009 (http://forum.killthecan.org/index.php?showtopic=2015) - one of the tightest group of quitters to come through this community. Post a day 157 tomorrow. Introduce yourself. If you already have another support group that will continue on now that you are far into your quit, that's great. If not, protect your quit with the support of others. It only takes a minute to post roll every morning. Make it a ritual.
I "quit" for nearly a year at one point a few years back. I found this site during that time but thought that the people were fucking idiots - bitching and fighting over nothing. I never joined a quit group. It only took one moment of weakness and I was back to a can a day. Now, with the support I have found with the people on this website, repeating that decision is not an option. I will do something else. I will remain quit.
Congrats on 156 or 1--? However someone chooses to judge your methods, you've taken a huge step for yourself. It is just a step. Do whatever it takes to keep the quit.
-Dave
Aww, you had to go and take my asshole post and respond with respect, intelligence, and candor? Seriously, you are a bigger man than I for doing that. The others I was able to drag down to my level, which is standard for the interwebs.
Seriously, though, I hope the rigidity here doesn't hurt the noob. People come here as their first glimpse of what a quit is like. If they happen to come here rather than the American Cancer Society, the various organs of the American Medical Association, and other informed communities of professionals, then they will get bad information. I hope they don't leave with the wrong idea, that quitting with the help of NRTs is not really quitting, that they might as well continue to dip if they feel they can't without the NRT (which I couldn't as I tried many times).
So, good luck, and I hope nobody dies because of this misinformation. Go ahead and make fun of me, but I'm not kidding. To me quitting dip wasn't a joke, but a serious matter.
With the exception of two people who posted here (smokeyg and raymwiii), people here were pretty much just waving their cocks around and full of crap jerking each other off circling the wagons. Again, I hope nobody dies because of the ignorance here.
OK, you are done with me and vice-versa. I wished to use your group, I would have been a good member of the April 2009 quit class, but you rebuffed me. Thank goodness I found other resources, and succeeded despite your misinformation.
I'll pay your game douschebag. By my math you have only been off Nicotine for 57 days. NRT is just an alternate delivery system for a nicotine habit. You might as well say I used to be a fag and liked takin it in the pooper, but I'm not queer anymore cuz I only suck dicks. Cold turkey quitting while brutal has excellent long term success rates. While I agree this site is not for everyone, it is effective. I chewed nicorette at 16 trying to quit dip. I used the patch on two seperate occasions, and then nicorette again in my early 30's. I never could break the withdrawls. Four days of no nic and massive support of real quitters broke that cycle no prob. You imply that quitting nicotine is a joke to those of us on this site? Then clearly you have underestimated the seriousness of both the site and its members. What's a joke is a tranny humping troll like you thinking you have quit nicotine when your still chewing nic gum or lozengers using the patch. While I congratulate you on your eventual 57 days of no nicotine, I have to warn you that you are in for a much rougher ride than you imagine. I wonder, are you familiar with the 70's not the decade dumbass. Anybody taught you about the funk yet? When it hits will you reach for your little piece of gum?
What you call bad information, is anecdotal (look it up retard) evidence from hundreds or perhaps 1000 quitters.Its gold, I can read their stories and learn from their victories and caves. I have read all the shit that you spout as gospel. American Cancer society, pfffth. Did you read recent evidence that there is a correlation between long term nic gum and lip cancer too ??? How's that make you feel. But you didn't use it longer than reccommended did you? hmmn, ok but dont go back to it. IDIOT, your comment about hoping nobody dies from misinformation about NRT is asinine. This site is about quitting NICOTINE , there are smokers here too. You can't be an alcoholic and say Im switching to light beer so now Im better. NO NICOTINE, no smokes, no cigars, no gum, no dip, no chew, no snus. Nothing. That is how you break free of the nic bitch. There are other sites more in tune with your pathetic quitting strategy, go to QS LITE, you can hold hands with all the other polite gum chewing campfire song singing jackoffs, This is a QUIT SITE. WE ARE QUITTERS UP IN HERE, not nicotine cessation therapy. In the collective words of May 08 you sir are a dildo Douchetard.
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I've got 156 days off the cat turds. Not sure how long off the NRT, something like 100 days but frankly I don't keep track of that. It was so easy to get off compared to the dip it doesn't feel worthy of my attention.
From the American Cancer Society page on smokeless tobacco, they have some bits on NRT:
http://www.cancer.org/docroot/PED/conte ... obacco.asp (http://www.cancer.org/docroot/PED/contentPED_10_13X_Quitting_Smokeless_Tobacco.asp)
Have fun being quit ya'll. Thanks for nothing. 'Finger'
Congrats quitnow. I read through your entire intro page right now and see that you initiated some very interesting debate and strong feelings from some of the quitters here. For that, this community owes you a bit of thanks. Anything that takes our mind off of urges is productive.
One point I would like to make, in an effort to support you - I highly suggest you use the strongest aspect of this site which is posting roll. Whatever a person's take on NRT, you are now officially clear of nicotine in all shapes and forms. Join the proper group for 156 days quit - April 2009 (http://forum.killthecan.org/index.php?showtopic=2015) - one of the tightest group of quitters to come through this community. Post a day 157 tomorrow. Introduce yourself. If you already have another support group that will continue on now that you are far into your quit, that's great. If not, protect your quit with the support of others. It only takes a minute to post roll every morning. Make it a ritual.
I "quit" for nearly a year at one point a few years back. I found this site during that time but thought that the people were fucking idiots - bitching and fighting over nothing. I never joined a quit group. It only took one moment of weakness and I was back to a can a day. Now, with the support I have found with the people on this website, repeating that decision is not an option. I will do something else. I will remain quit.
Congrats on 156 or 1--? However someone chooses to judge your methods, you've taken a huge step for yourself. It is just a step. Do whatever it takes to keep the quit.
-Dave
Aww, you had to go and take my asshole post and respond with respect, intelligence, and candor? Seriously, you are a bigger man than I for doing that. The others I was able to drag down to my level, which is standard for the interwebs.
Seriously, though, I hope the rigidity here doesn't hurt the noob. People come here as their first glimpse of what a quit is like. If they happen to come here rather than the American Cancer Society, the various organs of the American Medical Association, and other informed communities of professionals, then they will get bad information. I hope they don't leave with the wrong idea, that quitting with the help of NRTs is not really quitting, that they might as well continue to dip if they feel they can't without the NRT (which I couldn't as I tried many times).
So, good luck, and I hope nobody dies because of this misinformation. Go ahead and make fun of me, but I'm not kidding. To me quitting dip wasn't a joke, but a serious matter.
With the exception of two people who posted here (smokeyg and raymwiii), people here were pretty much just waving their cocks around and full of crap jerking each other off circling the wagons. Again, I hope nobody dies because of the ignorance here.
OK, you are done with me and vice-versa. I wished to use your group, I would have been a good member of the April 2009 quit class, but you rebuffed me. Thank goodness I found other resources, and succeeded despite your misinformation.
quitnow - I'm curious...what means of support do you have going forward with your quit? You obviously have an agenda here which has nothing to do with quitting. No one rebuffed you. You rebuffed yourself with your constant negativity. Shit, you even responded to my efforts of support by saying, "I hope nobody dies because of the ignorance here". If I had to put money down, I would wager you are nothing more than an internet troll looking for attention. Maybe you did quit nicotine, but you coming to this community has nothing to do with nicotine cessation. It all about attention and feeling important. Trust me, you're not important.
Let's end this shit and watch this thread slowly be buried under the real quitters. Let quitnow move it back up.
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I'll pay your game douschebag. By my math you have only been off Nicotine for 57 days. NRT is just an alternate delivery system for a nicotine habit. You might as well say I used to be a fag and liked takin it in the pooper, but I'm not queer anymore cuz I only suck dicks. Cold turkey quitting while brutal has excellent long term success rates. While I agree this site is not for everyone, it is effective. I chewed nicorette at 16 trying to quit dip. I used the patch on two seperate occasions, and then nicorette again in my early 30's. I never could break the withdrawls. Four days of no nic and massive support of real quitters broke that cycle no prob. You imply that quitting nicotine is a joke to those of us on this site? Then clearly you have underestimated the seriousness of both the site and its members. What's a joke is a tranny humping troll like you thinking you have quit nicotine when your still chewing nic gum or lozengers using the patch. While I congratulate you on your eventual 57 days of no nicotine, I have to warn you that you are in for a much rougher ride than you imagine. I wonder, are you familiar with the 70's not the decade dumbass. Anybody taught you about the funk yet? When it hits will you reach for your little piece of gum?
What you call bad information, is anecdotal (look it up retard) evidence from hundreds or perhaps 1000 quitters.Its gold, I can read their stories and learn from their victories and caves. I have read all the shit that you spout as gospel. American Cancer society, pfffth. Did you read recent evidence that there is a correlation between long term nic gum and lip cancer too ??? How's that make you feel. But you didn't use it longer than reccommended did you? hmmn, ok but dont go back to it. IDIOT, your comment about hoping nobody dies from misinformation about NRT is asinine. This site is about quitting NICOTINE , there are smokers here too. You can't be an alcoholic and say Im switching to light beer so now Im better. NO NICOTINE, no smokes, no cigars, no gum, no dip, no chew, no snus. Nothing. That is how you break free of the nic bitch. There are other sites more in tune with your pathetic quitting strategy, go to QS LITE, you can hold hands with all the other polite gum chewing campfire song singing jackoffs, This is a QUIT SITE. WE ARE QUITTERS UP IN HERE, not nicotine cessation therapy. In the collective words of May 08 you sir are a dildo Douchetard.
This... is... AWESOME.
http://www.killthecan.org/files/chewie_awesome.mp3
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I'll pay your game douschebag. By my math you have only been off Nicotine for 57 days. NRT is just an alternate delivery system for a nicotine habit. You might as well say I used to be a fag and liked takin it in the pooper, but I'm not queer anymore cuz I only suck dicks. Cold turkey quitting while brutal has excellent long term success rates. While I agree this site is not for everyone, it is effective. I chewed nicorette at 16 trying to quit dip. I used the patch on two seperate occasions, and then nicorette again in my early 30's. I never could break the withdrawls. Four days of no nic and massive support of real quitters broke that cycle no prob. You imply that quitting nicotine is a joke to those of us on this site? Then clearly you have underestimated the seriousness of both the site and its members. What's a joke is a tranny humping troll like you thinking you have quit nicotine when your still chewing nic gum or lozengers using the patch. While I congratulate you on your eventual 57 days of no nicotine, I have to warn you that you are in for a much rougher ride than you imagine. I wonder, are you familiar with the 70's not the decade dumbass. Anybody taught you about the funk yet? When it hits will you reach for your little piece of gum?
    What you call bad information, is anecdotal (look it up retard) evidence from hundreds or perhaps 1000 quitters.Its gold, I can read their stories and learn from their victories and caves. I have read all the shit that you spout as gospel. American Cancer society, pfffth. Did you read recent evidence that there is a correlation between long term nic gum and lip cancer too ??? How's that make you feel. But you didn't use it longer than reccommended did you? hmmn, ok but dont go back to it. IDIOT, your comment about hoping nobody dies from misinformation about NRT is asinine. This site is about quitting NICOTINE , there are smokers here too. You can't be an alcoholic and say Im switching to light beer so now Im better. NO NICOTINE, no smokes, no cigars, no gum, no dip, no chew, no snus. Nothing. That is how you break free of the nic bitch. There are other sites more in tune with your pathetic quitting strategy, go to QS LITE, you can hold hands with all the other polite gum chewing campfire song singing jackoffs, This is a QUIT SITE. WE ARE QUITTERS UP IN HERE, not nicotine cessation therapy. In the collective words of May 08 you sir are a dildo Douchetard.
ABSOLUTELY FUCKING HILARIOUS!!!!.....Skoal Monster, way to speak my and many others' minds here!!!!
Mike
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I'll pay your game douschebag. By my math you have only been off Nicotine for 57 days. NRT is just an alternate delivery system for a nicotine habit. You might as well say I used to be a fag and liked takin it in the pooper, but I'm not queer anymore cuz I only suck dicks. Cold turkey quitting while brutal has excellent long term success rates. While I agree this site is not for everyone, it is effective. I chewed nicorette at 16 trying to quit dip. I used the patch on two seperate occasions, and then nicorette again in my early 30's. I never could break the withdrawls. Four days of no nic and massive support of real quitters broke that cycle no prob. You imply that quitting nicotine is a joke to those of us on this site? Then clearly you have underestimated the seriousness of both the site and its members. What's a joke is a tranny humping troll like you thinking you have quit nicotine when your still chewing nic gum or lozengers using the patch. While I congratulate you on your eventual 57 days of no nicotine, I have to warn you that you are in for a much rougher ride than you imagine. I wonder, are you familiar with the 70's not the decade dumbass. Anybody taught you about the funk yet? When it hits will you reach for your little piece of gum?
    What you call bad information, is anecdotal (look it up retard) evidence from hundreds or perhaps 1000 quitters.Its gold, I can read their stories and learn from their victories and caves. I have read all the shit that you spout as gospel. American Cancer society, pfffth. Did you read recent evidence that there is a correlation between long term nic gum and lip cancer too ??? How's that make you feel. But you didn't use it longer than reccommended did you? hmmn, ok but dont go back to it. IDIOT, your comment about hoping nobody dies from misinformation about NRT is asinine. This site is about quitting NICOTINE , there are smokers here too. You can't be an alcoholic and say Im switching to light beer so now Im better. NO NICOTINE, no smokes, no cigars, no gum, no dip, no chew, no snus. Nothing. That is how you break free of the nic bitch. There are other sites more in tune with your pathetic quitting strategy, go to QS LITE, you can hold hands with all the other polite gum chewing campfire song singing jackoffs, This is a QUIT SITE. WE ARE QUITTERS UP IN HERE, not nicotine cessation therapy. In the collective words of May 08 you sir are a dildo Douchetard.
ABSOLUTELY FUCKING HILARIOUS!!!!.....Skoal Monster, way to speak my and many others' minds here!!!!
Mike
Agree, Mike!!! Good job Skoal brother.
This fag thinks by using words like "dogmatic" twice in a reply he sounds smart when in actuality he has misconstrued and misinterpreted just about 99% of what was said in this entire thread.
Agree with Smokey, let it die.
Oh by the way, did I mention I came merrily along here, 2 weeks into my quit but still chewing the NRT gum? Difference is, when I was offered the same advice, I immediately quit and didn't fucking whine like a little girl.
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Who gives a fuck....do you....ill do me
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I'll pay your game douschebag. By my math you have only been off Nicotine for 57 days. NRT is just an alternate delivery system for a nicotine habit. You might as well say I used to be a fag and liked takin it in the pooper, but I'm not queer anymore cuz I only suck dicks. Cold turkey quitting while brutal has excellent long term success rates. While I agree this site is not for everyone, it is effective. I chewed nicorette at 16 trying to quit dip. I used the patch on two seperate occasions, and then nicorette again in my early 30's. I never could break the withdrawls. Four days of no nic and massive support of real quitters broke that cycle no prob. You imply that quitting nicotine is a joke to those of us on this site? Then clearly you have underestimated the seriousness of both the site and its members. What's a joke is a tranny humping troll like you thinking you have quit nicotine when your still chewing nic gum or lozengers using the patch. While I congratulate you on your eventual 57 days of no nicotine, I have to warn you that you are in for a much rougher ride than you imagine. I wonder, are you familiar with the 70's not the decade dumbass. Anybody taught you about the funk yet? When it hits will you reach for your little piece of gum?
    What you call bad information, is anecdotal (look it up retard) evidence from hundreds or perhaps 1000 quitters.Its gold, I can read their stories and learn from their victories and caves. I have read all the shit that you spout as gospel. American Cancer society, pfffth. Did you read recent evidence that there is a correlation between long term nic gum and lip cancer too ??? How's that make you feel. But you didn't use it longer than reccommended did you? hmmn, ok but dont go back to it. IDIOT, your comment about hoping nobody dies from misinformation about NRT is asinine. This site is about quitting NICOTINE , there are smokers here too. You can't be an alcoholic and say Im switching to light beer so now Im better. NO NICOTINE, no smokes, no cigars, no gum, no dip, no chew, no snus. Nothing. That is how you break free of the nic bitch. There are other sites more in tune with your pathetic quitting strategy, go to QS LITE, you can hold hands with all the other polite gum chewing campfire song singing jackoffs, This is a QUIT SITE. WE ARE QUITTERS UP IN HERE, not nicotine cessation therapy. In the collective words of May 08 you sir are a dildo Douchetard.
I obviously touched a nerve, so let me explain a couple of things again to clear up your confusion. Take a deep breath. Skoal Monster, you might need to put on two thinking caps.
First, let me get this straight. I cite double blind research trials that show the probability of quitting is doubled using NRT (nic replacement therapy). You call such studies "anecdotes", and go on to cite your personal failure to quit using NRT in order to dismiss what I'm saying as anecdotal. You also seem compelled to employ homoerotic and gender identity allusions. Perhaps I'm missing the logic of your argument, and frankly am not interested in your sexual preferences or gender confusion.
Note for people who are actually serious and following this thread, they will see I never said it was a good idea to use NRT in the long term. As I already mentioned, it is known that long-term users of NRT typically fail in their quit, there are potential other health risks involved with nicotine use (though the cancer link is not established conclusively), in addition to the obvious chemical dependence. In other words, NRT has to be part of a rational quit plan, which includes getting off the NRT within three months.
The upshot is, if you can't quit dip without NRT, then quit with the NRT. This is a no brainer, and hopefully those of you that have more than a brain stem will see this.
NRT is much better for you than the dip. The worst carcinogen in dip are the tobacco-specific nitrosamines which tends to be very high in dip. Ask your doctor which is better: dipping or using NRT, what do you think she will say? This is just common sense, reading some of the crap here you'd think it was just as bad as the dip.
I hope nobody dies because of the ignorance, arrogance, and hostility toward alternative quit strategies people show on this site. There are alteratives such as QSSN, therapy, calling quit lines. You can use NRT, or not. It's up to you. People here have chosen one path, and some of them like to call it the only path, and are like religious fanatics about it. Hopefully someone will read this and it will help them in their attempts to quit the dip, the primary purpose of this site.
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First off, we give our word not to use tobacco in any form by posting roll call here before engaging in debate. If you're gonna come to our house and try to tell us we're wrong, perhaps you could at least have enough courtesy to wipe the shit off your shoes on the way in.
The debate over whether or not to use NRT will rage on here long after all of us have closed the door on our quit and passed the torch to others to help folks break their addiction. But you coined a few phrases that are very common to folks who are using NRT as that little blue pill that is going to make quitting easy.
if you can't quit dip without NRT
"Can't" pfft. The fact of the matter is can or can't is in the attitude, not the means used to achieve it. If you say, you CAN quit tobacco whatever it takes, you will succeed. I'm quite sure of it. If you say you can't, no matter what it is that follows, you are right.
help them in their attempts to quit the dip,
Perhaps you've never actually looked at the definition of "attempt". Here is MSN Encarta's dictionary version: http://encarta.msn.com/encnet/features/ ... ch=attempt (http://encarta.msn.com/encnet/features/dictionary/DictionaryResults.aspx?lextype=3&search=attempt) Pay particular attenion to last part of that definition....you know.... the part that says "especially without much expectation of success". If someone is only "attempting" a quit, I don't care to have them around me because it is inevitable that all they will do is drag me and my friends down.
So I will reiterate that success or failure is simply in the attitude. There is no easy way to undo what we have done to ourselves when we chose to dip. A constant decision to not dip is really at the heart of what must be done, no matter what other means you put into the decision.
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quitnow - I'm curious...what means of support do you have going forward with your quit? You obviously have an agenda here which has nothing to do with quitting. No one rebuffed you. You rebuffed yourself with your constant negativity. Shit, you even responded to my efforts of support by saying, "I hope nobody dies because of the ignorance here". If I had to put money down, I would wager you are nothing more than an internet troll looking for attention. Maybe you did quit nicotine, but you coming to this community has nothing to do with nicotine cessation. It all about attention and feeling important. Trust me, you're not important.Â
Let's end this shit and watch this thread slowly be buried under the real quitters. Let quitnow move it back up.Â
Did you actually read my first post here in this thread, and the initial responses? Perhaps English is your second language? If so, point out which parts are giving you trouble and I'll be glad to help.
On a serious note, I have used the Quit Smokeless Support Network (QSSN) site since I found it around day five. They are more flexible in how people achieve the goal of getting off the dip. I'm in the April 2009 quit group (this site (http://forum.qssn.org/index.php?showtopic=750)) signed up as quitnow feel free to check it out. On January 18, 2010 it will be a year of quit.
My first post here was on January 17, the day before my quit. I was earnestly looking for help and asking if I could join even though I was using NRT.
But sure, smokeyg, you got me pegged, I'm a troll. Indeed, I still post roll every day at QSSN just to keep up appearances, and make it seem that my first post here was legitimate. Can't get anything by on you! You get to ride the front of the bus today! 'Remshot'
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First off, we give our word not to use tobacco in any form by posting roll call here before engaging in debate. If you're gonna come to our house and try to tell us we're wrong, perhaps you could at least have enough courtesy to wipe the shit off your shoes on the way in.Â
The debate over whether or not to use NRT will rage on here long after all of us have closed the door on our quit and passed the torch to others to help folks break their addiction. But you coined a few phrases that are very common to folks who are using NRT as that little blue pill that is going to make quitting easy.
if you can't quit dip without NRT
"Can't" pfft. The fact of the matter is can or can't is in the attitude, not the means used to achieve it. If you say, you CAN quit tobacco whatever it takes, you will succeed. I'm quite sure of it. If you say you can't, no matter what it is that follows, you are right.
Short bus, read the thread. I used the NRT initially in my quit, not now. Also, while your focus on words makes for cutesy amateur psychology and might entertain some of your rapt subjects, such semantic quibbling doesn't merit a serious response. It is a substanceless critique, a pedantic trifle. Congratulations you know how to look up words in a dictionary.
Anyway, getting to the substantial argument: that's good if you could quit without the NRT. I'm glad. I tried dozens of times cold turkey and failed. This shit isn't hypothetical for me. I was dying and needed to quit. Then I tried to quit just once once with the NRT and it worked (no dip for 335 days, and no NRT since day 55 or so). So, in my particular case, which worked better? Can you answer that question please?
It is great reinforcment to see I made the right choice in my quit support network. Good to see that admin at this site belittles and quibbles with people's efforts to quit the dip. I hope nobody dies because of the attitudes displayed here toward people similar to me. For me quitting was not a joke not a luxury.
Keep circling the wagons, rally your troops. With the exception of a couple of rational responses, you have shown emotional overreactions, petty belitting, and name calling. Great site you have here.
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I read and reread my post and can't see where I accused you of using NRT. But I'm still not seeing where you've posted roll, so as far as I'm concerned you're on day nothing.
The only name calling I can see in this exchange between us is "short bus" and that was typed in by...hmm....let me see. Whatever, I've wasted enough of the life of this keyboard on this. Time for this thread to fade to nowhere again.
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First off, we give our word not to use tobacco in any form by posting roll call here before engaging in debate. If you're gonna come to our house and try to tell us we're wrong, perhaps you could at least have enough courtesy to wipe the shit off your shoes on the way in.Â
The debate over whether or not to use NRT will rage on here long after all of us have closed the door on our quit and passed the torch to others to help folks break their addiction. But you coined a few phrases that are very common to folks who are using NRT as that little blue pill that is going to make quitting easy.
if you can't quit dip without NRT
"Can't" pfft. The fact of the matter is can or can't is in the attitude, not the means used to achieve it. If you say, you CAN quit tobacco whatever it takes, you will succeed. I'm quite sure of it. If you say you can't, no matter what it is that follows, you are right.
Short bus, read the thread. I used the NRT initially in my quit, not now. Also, while your focus on words makes for cutesy amateur psychology and might entertain some of your rapt subjects, such semantic quibbling doesn't merit a serious response. It is a substanceless critique, a pedantic trifle. Congratulations you know how to look up words in a dictionary.
Anyway, getting to the substantial argument: that's good if you could quit without the NRT. I'm glad. I tried dozens of times cold turkey and failed. This shit isn't hypothetical for me. I was dying and needed to quit. Then I tried to quit just once once with the NRT and it worked (no dip for 335 days, and no NRT since day 55 or so). So, in my particular case, which worked better? Can you answer that question please?
It is great reinforcment to see I made the right choice in my quit support network. Good to see that admin at this site belittles and quibbles with people's efforts to quit the dip. I hope nobody dies because of the attitudes displayed here toward people similar to me. For me quitting was not a joke not a luxury.
Keep circling the wagons, rally your troops. With the exception of a couple of rational responses, you have shown emotional overreactions, petty belitting, and name calling. Great site you have here.
Whatever, dude. Good for you if you are quit.
We're quit too. And we like the methods used here, and we happen to think that this is a great support system.
The difference between you, and us.....it appears you were still a slave to nicotine 55 days into your "quit". We were not.
If you don't like this web site and the type of support that it provides, then get the fuck lost.
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Again, in my case, which method was best? I tried cold turkey dozens of times and failed. I tried with NRT once and I am now almost a year without dip after an initial use of NRT for less than two months.
Wich method was best in my particular case?
But I'm still not seeing where you've posted roll, so as far as I'm concerned you're on day nothing.
OK, when you said I need to wipe my feet and post roll because I am on day nothing you mean I am disrespecting you by not posting roll as per the policies of the site?
Are you seriously admin here? Read the page entitled: If You Are Planning to Quit, Read This First, Information for Those Who Haven't Quit. I include it below for your edification.
That doesnÂ’t mean you have to leave. Please feel free to post in the Cafe`. Ask questions, start making contacts. Learn. Post in the Introductions area. Many quitters will respond to you in both of these areas. We have a chat room. You can also go into there for some live chat. When you are ready, and want to post day 1, find your quit group and post up. It will be a day you never forget.
Please anyone reading this if you are trying to quit do it any way you can. There are many ways to stop dipping if you go cold turkey great. If you use NRT as part of a plan to wean off within three months, also great. If you use Jesus, Mohammed, Moses, or just this group, another group, a therapist, porn, whatever. Just quit this shit it will kill you.
To me it isn't a game. Take pot shots at me I can take it. But please think twice before belittling someone initially in their quit that is using NRT. I hope nobody dies because of misinformation here.
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I never go to other threads like roll call because I am not a member here and I never will be.
Don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out.
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If you don't like this web site and the type of support that it provides, then get the fuck lost.
Gladly. But what of the person on day one using nicotine gum. Will you belittle them, tell them they are a slave, to not let the door hit them on the way out? Or will you try to help them stop dipping even if it means they want to go an alternative route? Sure, if someone wants to go cold turkey, they need some tough love when they are tempted to resort to NRT. That's not what I'm talking about.
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If you don't like this web site and the type of support that it provides, then get the fuck lost.
Gladly. But what of the person on day one using nicotine gum. Will you belittle them, tell them they are a slave, to not let the door hit them on the way out? Or will you try to help them stop dipping even if it means they want to go an alternative route? Sure, if someone wants to go cold turkey, they need some tough love when they are tempted to resort to NRT. That's not what I'm talking about.
No. We do all we can to help someone wanting to quit. And we strongly encourage those using NRT's to ditch them.
We are NOT here to only quit dipping. We are here to beat a nicotine addiction, in all of its forms. When you quit at QSX, and you post roll, committing to quitting here, you are expected to not use nicotine IN ANY FORM. No cigarettes, no snus, snuff, dip, chewing tobacco, cigars.
If NRT's are used strictly AS DIRECTED, I think you are allowed to post roll here. But like I said....we strongly discourage the use of NRT's.
tell them they are a slave,
And yes, if you still have nicotine coursing through your veins, I will call you a slave.
to not let the door hit them on the way out?
Exactly why are you here?? You are in OUR house. And I'll admit, I haven't read this whole damn thread, but from what I have seen, you have been nothing but confrontational. You wanna play, go post roll. Otherwise, well. I'm not gonna repeat myself.
I hope nobody dies because of misinformation here.
Encouraging cold turkey, as opposed to NRT's, is hardly misinformation. The fact of the matter is, you will overcome the nicotine addiction SOONER if you quit cold turkey. And the SOONER YOU BREAK THE NICOTINE ADDICTION, THE LESS CHANCE YOU HAVE OF RETURNING TO YOUR FAVORITE CAN OF CANCER. Nicotine is gone from your system in a matter of days when you quit cold turkey. Then the quit is all about being mentally strong. Why would you want to prolong the pain of withdrawals and cleasing your system, by using NRT's????
Congrats on being quit. For your sake, I hope your support system will truly hold you accountable and be there for you when you need it the most.
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Good luck staying off the dip, and I pray that nobody dies of oral cancer because they got preachy dogmatic arrogance from coming here.
No, fella. Someone might die because they didn't have the intestinal fortitude to quit, and stay quit.
There is NO ONE at this site holding a gun to anyone's head, forcing them to continue dipping.
An addict has a choice - quit, or don't quit.
If someone doesn't like the methods used here, they can always have their balls coddled elsewhere.
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At any rate, anyone out there reading this : know that there is more than one way, there is not only one way to quit. Talk to therapists, doctors, and other people online if you want a more synoptic, balanced, and objective perspective. The world is bigger than people here seem to realize. Don't take my word for it, do some research.
Word. Certainly is more than one way to get the job done.
It is not required of us to by more synoptic, balanced, or objective. We've got our methods, you have yours, and Tom, Dick, and Harry have theirs.
This is how WE roll. Watch that door, bro.
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Fact of the matter is that 90% of successful quits are cold turkey Whyquit.com My guess is you would have been successful in this quit regardless, did you step down at the intervals prescribed? or did you shorten the process? If you didn't use it for the prescribed period of 8 or 12 weeks (can't remember) then in effect you DID quit cold turkey. If you were still chewing multiple pieces a day you had a good level of nic in your blood stream when you finally decided to kick.
Some thoughts on NRT from one who chewed the gum for over a year, and used the patch for two separate month long stretches.
Niccorette gum and lozenges has been linked to an increased incidence of mouth and espohogeal cancer. That was what I was trying to avoid in the first place.
This whole addiction is about quitting nicotine, when I tried NRT's I was still using.
Alchoholics aren't told to drink lite beer to get sober. In my opinion there is no difference. Except maybe instead of giving your money to big tobacco you can give it to big Pharm.
The weaning down process puts you into withdrawl, anybody that says different is a damn liar or a very casual user of tobacco. If you follow the directions for the gum/patch/lozenge/ you WILL feel withdrawls. They are less than the withdrawls from cold turkey I agree. HOWEVER, they last for weeks and weeks instead of days. This is one of the reasons this site rails against the use of NRT's anyone who is knowledgeable about nicotine abuse understands that the withdrawls will be drawn out and there is a huge chance of abuse of the NRT. This theory is supported by Alan Carr in his book on quitting, Joel Spitzer (google him) numerous research papers on nicotine addiction, AND the experience of several thousand quitters here and on other spit tobacco quit sites.
The pure truth that you miss quitnow is that you actually quit this time "in spite" of the gum or patch or anal nic suppository you used. I am happy for you because I wouldn't wish that addiction on my worst enemy, BUT don't go endorsing a product that you don't have a fucking clue about other than you used it and you think it worked. Do some deeper research, not funded by Pharm and you'll find I'm not bullshitting you. As for the site , I believe the rule is that NRT is acceptable if it used in exact accordance with the instructions. (which I'm pretty sure you didn't do by the way) . The culture of the site and the experience of the quitters is what is against using it, not the site.
In any case, as the man said. Don't let the door hit you in the ass on your way out. But congratulations on your 60 days of freedom from ...NRT? or dip? eitherway a good start. Hopefully your love affair with nic gum doesn't lead to a relapse, If so try it our way.
QUIT or DON'T there is no middle ground, there is no try. There is no option for failure, if you fail here, get out. This is a brotherhood of tough love and no bullshit honesty. This is not a debate on alternative methods that are possibly helpful. This is a cage fight with a horrible addiction that we have found a cure for. If you can't agree with that then there are plenty of other places that will hold your hand and sing sweetly to you when your stuffing your face with cancer , or playing where should I stick the patch today. Try putting it over your mouth.
:angry: Skoal Monster day 327 :angry: 'blowup'
My next response will not be so sweet , sorry if your offended (not really) This IS real and NOT a game. people like you with a sprinkling of knowledge and limited success preaching the gospel of NRT's are dangerous for others. So you know as well, I have been to therapists, other nic support groups, used medication to help ,me quit etc. I am well aware of ALL of it.
What it took to beat a 23 year 2 can a day addiction. Was this " Skoal Monster day 1"
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Dear Quitnow
I forgot who you were, til I read the whole thread. Then I went to April09 on Lite and read it from today back to your 86th day. SNORE! At which point I lost interest. Your not a half bad quitter so I retract most of the beastiality slams. Although I get the impression your a vet? and you do like to use the word DOGmatic. In any case I have quoted you directly from your own posts, the majority are in full so as not to be taken out of context. I fail to see your motive to come here and say something so offensive about a person dying because they were driven away by our method of quit and lack of support for NRT use. Are you trying to justify it for yourself? Either way I don't care, your own posts detail what is wrong with NRT use. I'm glad it worked for you, but your obviously conflicted about it. My suggestion is that you accept that our two sites are yin and yang. This is a hard edge group with a single criteria of success, yours is different. There is no purpose in you pushing your agenda in here other than to confuse and anger the members Take your shit back to lite and post it in that abomination you call a quit group. I agree with Smokeys original assessment that this thread should just sink to the bottom of page 9 . I won't get sucked into this any more. Thanks for the read tho, it just solidifies my own quit and thankfulness that I am here with serious quitters.
but I have to remember I cannot master the nicotine in a complete sense. The best I can do is not use it. And that's the sense I take it when people talk of having mastery or control, as that is the only sense that is reasonable.
June 16th 09. Your argument is valid, the law of addiction supports this. How does NRT use fit in with this. You either use a substance and maintain your addiction in some form, or you don't.
My crutch was the nicotine gum, and it was tough to give it up but I did wean myself off it.
This would seem to validate the theory of dragging out the physical aspect . Agree?
I have a confession. I caved this morning.
I made it 121 days... 4 months.
I've been concerned for some time about my replacement therapy.... nicotine gum, energy drinks and most seriously, too much beer drinking.
May 20 2009, 07:58 AM
This guy was in your group at QSLite, This is a excellent example of why I hate NRT's . This guy was never quit. At 4 months he was deluded into thinking he had somehow quit. Again, you gotta understand that this ISNT about tobacco, it is about nicotine. He was still physically addicted. In my mind this is a trap. He had a false belief that he was stronger than he was, further along in recovery. He was lying to himself. How is that quitting, where is the support in allowing a fellow addict to delude himself? At best your complicit.
That said, if I have to choose (and I do) nic gum versus no nicotine in my system, I go with the no nicotine. I think I still have some reservations about nic gum that I don't about dip. I still have tons of nicotine gum all over the place. I should probably get rid of it. At some point, when I feel more secure in my nic quit, I will write not just my HOF speech, but a whole bunch of crap about what it was like quitting using the nic gum. I'm still processing how it made my quit different from people who didn't make the gum part of their plan. Short version: it helped a lot, but did make for a slightly different quit trajectory. Upshot: I couldn't have done it without it, and I'd do it again the same way, but those that didn't use it my hat is off to you.
I have no issue with your personal success, I firmly believe you succeeded in spite of the NRT and not because of them. Again, think hard about the law of addiction. When you reintroduce nicotine to your body your brain lights up all the old nicotine receptors putting you back into a crave mode. Are you under some illusion that nicotine in and of itself isn't bad? I agree it is "less" dangerous than dipping, but still carries all the same baggage of addiction, withdrawls, health. What's the point?
This place was the last resort for me. Dip kicked my ass, hard. I tried so many fucking times to have "just one can." I went years without a dip only to have "just one can" that it took me four years to put down. And here I am. I am under no illusion that I can do this shit safely.
The fact that you finally figured out that there is no just one, and felt you were in a "last resort" scenario is one of the reasons your successful. It took alot of years for my dumbass to realize that I couldn't have just one. When I finally swallowed that pill, I quit......for real. I'm guessing your the same.
One thing I noticed: I used the nicotine gum to help me quit. It's been about a month or so now since I've chewed it. One cool thing about my quit is that usually my cravings aren't for dip, but for nicotine gum. For me, that's a safe crave in some ways. If I chew a piece of nic gum, I would consider that a bad thing, a relapse of sorts, but nothing as bad as going back to dip.
Either way, when I think about using nicotine gum or dip, I feel sick to my stomach. The fact is if we dip now we will get nauseated. It will not be fun. We have no tolerance. So the nic bitch is just lying if she is telling you that you would enjoy the dip. Believe me, I've relapsed after long periods quit, and the first dip was awful. I feel sick just thinking about it.
You start to get it here, at the end, but you miss. Going back to nicotine gum is going back to dipping is becoming an addict all over. You document craving an NRT, you demonstrate both a desire for and acceptance of nic gum. This also shows that at this stage you still viewed it as safe. The second paragraph shows where your turning the corner. THIS CONFLICT HAS TO PROVE TO YOU THAT NICOTINE IS THE PROBLEM. The delivery method is irrelevent.
This refers to your use of Snus, please explain how "this" nicotine delivery system is different that nicotine gum? Give you a hint, it's not. You actually even see it here when you highlight the fact that it will ultimately lead back to addiction.
I used it a couple of times when I was trying to quit, before I found this site. It didn't help. I was back to the Skoal within a day. It's like Skoal Bandits for girls, basically, with a lower percentage of tobacco and more weird flavors and spices added. If you like real dip, this stuff will basically make you crave Skoal because it is so weak. They even market it as not needing to spit.
In terms of safety issues, it is true that it seems to not cause oral cancer. Its use is extremely high in Sweden, where they have basically zero oral cancer.
That said, there are still other risks as you mentioned. For one, brown teeth, cavities, all that negative oral hygeine stuff. Then there's the cost, the fact that you would once again be addicted to nicotine.
sM
P.S. - Apple fucking skoal? Really ? Apple ? I guess it would still kill you but fuck.
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About to hit four years. 'Finger'
Happy quit to all, especially the haters and stalkers.
For those citing "data" (i.e., anecdotes from Cousin Billy Bob and self)
http://whyquit.com/pr/123106.html (http://whyquit.com/pr/123106.html)
Plus, the most important datum is that I am free of dip (and using NRT as prescribed helped me tremendously).
At any rate, glad I found a good fit for me on day one rather than Quixotically staying on the short bus with Gomer and Co. 'zombie'
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About to hit four years. 'Finger'
Happy quit to all, especially the haters and stalkers.
For those citing "data" (i.e., anecdotes from Cousin Billy Bob and self):
http://whyquit.com/pr/123106.html (http://whyquit.com/pr/123106.html)
Plus, the most important datum is that I am free of dip (and using NRT as prescribed helped me tremendously).
At any rate, glad I found a good fit for me on day one rather than Quixotically staying on the short bus with Gomer and Co. 'zombie'
Look dude. I don't know you, but after reading old posts, get the fuck out of here with your nrt shit. Obviously there are two theories on that stuff and obviously you know this sites stance on it. So why come in here flipping the bird and citing data about SMOKING cessation? This is a smokless quit site you dumb fuck. If this were a face to face encounter I would take that bird and shove it up you nicorette gummed ass. But something tells me you're only tough behind your little keyboard.
We have guys newly quit battling their asses off to make their quit work cold turkey. They know this is a cold turkey site, they don't need to be reading your bullshit. Keep your shit on your side of the fence.
You must be one pathetic person with nothing better to do than to come in here like a little fucking pussy waving your smily face middle finger around.
Get fucked you two bit, spineless, pathetic, no good, avatar humping, cum guzzling, piece of shit, HACK!
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I know that was childish dropping down to his level, and that was probably exactly the response he was trolling for...but that felt pretty damn good going off on that guy.
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Poof
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I've found a place that is more congruent with my approach so this'll be my last visit here. Good luck and congrats to you all.
Man you can't even keep your word. What kind of man are you?..You keep coming back, you must need us.. We don't even know who you are, or if you are even quit? Tell you what, sign up in April and promise not to use today and I will quit with you. You might actually like this place! I also know you will come back to this site to see what responses you have gotten for your stupid comment...That is just what trolls do.
Welcome Back
Waketech 120
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I've found a place that is more congruent with my approach so this'll be my last visit here. Good luck and congrats to you all.
What are you, about 120 days quit, cold turke? Probably a good time for some NRT. Glad nobody here killed you after you made your first post.