KillTheCan.org Accountability Forum
Community => Introductions => Topic started by: stew5978 on September 01, 2013, 04:47:00 PM
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Name is Stew. I have been dipping since I was 16 (35 now), when I began working at a private shooting range. Guns and Rednecks, it wasn't long before I picked up the habit. Ended a 2-3 can a week habit of Cope Straight on Monday (making this day six for me).
Quitting for myself and family. Two year old son with another on the way in March. Plan to be here a long time for both and I don't want them to remember me ever dipping.
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Name is Stew. I have been dipping since I was 16 (35 now), when I began working at a private shooting range. Guns and Rednecks, it wasn't long before I picked up the habit. Ended a 2-3 can a week habit of Cope Straight on Monday (making this day six for me).
Quitting for myself and family. Two year old son with another on the way in March. Plan to be here a long time for both and I don't want them to remember me ever dipping.
Welcome to freedom Stew. I would suggest clicking on the welcome center link at the top of the page. Learn how to post roll and do it everyday. Ask questions and read all you can on this site. We have your back here. You can do it man.
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Congrats Stew welcome to the site! KC is right, in no time you'll have more guys watching your back than you thought possible, this is really powerful stuff! Ask any questions you want or PM for cell #'s if you need too.
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I have been posting roll since day 2. Thanks
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I have been posting roll since day 2. Thanks
Hell yeah. That's what we like to hear. Another wonderful tool I used is the link that describes what your body and mind will go through during your quit. That way you know what's coming. Reading peoples intros and hof speeches are great motivation too.
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Man, I love me some guns and rednecks but hey, I'm from Texas.
I quit with you.
QLF
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Great choice, Stew!!! You can do this. One day at a time is the key.
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so i know everybody is different, but has anybody besides me seen a reduction in appetite?
on day 25 now, but the first 2 weeks, i had to force myself to eat. most food didn't taste good. i have actually lost 10lbs in these 25 days.
now i can eat and food tastes better, but the quantity i have been has seemed to be cut in half. i just don't seem to want to eat as much.
please forgive my ramblings and incoherence as i am fight a severe case of the fog/suck right now.
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so i know everybody is different, but has anybody besides me seen a reduction in appetite?
on day 25 now, but the first 2 weeks, i had to force myself to eat. most food didn't taste good. i have actually lost 10lbs in these 25 days.
now i can eat and food tastes better, but the quantity i have been has seemed to be cut in half. i just don't seem to want to eat as much.
please forgive my ramblings and incoherence as i am fight a severe case of the fog/suck right now.
First of all ramble all you want, this site is your avenue to vent from your fog and general suck.
I too went through a spell where my appetite wasn't the same. When I was a dipper I used to eat as though I had a tapeworm. Always eating in mass portions of food.
I still do not get as hungry as I once did but from what I have heard from others that is a good thing.
Pinched
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so i know everybody is different, but has anybody besides me seen a reduction in appetite?
on day 25 now, but the first 2 weeks, i had to force myself to eat. most food didn't taste good. i have actually lost 10lbs in these 25 days.
now i can eat and food tastes better, but the quantity i have been has seemed to be cut in half. i just don't seem to want to eat as much.
please forgive my ramblings and incoherence as i am fight a severe case of the fog/suck right now.
First of all ramble all you want, this site is your avenue to vent from your fog and general suck.
I too went through a spell where my appetite wasn't the same. When I was a dipper I used to eat as though I had a tapeworm. Always eating in mass portions of food.
I still do not get as hungry as I once did but from what I have heard from others that is a good thing.
Pinched
You guys should consider yourself lucky with that. Hell I never ate before but now that I am no longer a slave, food just tastes so much better and I want to eat a whole lot more than I ever did before. I work out around 3 hours a day at least just so I don't get crazy big. All that matters though is that you are quit. Those few extra pounds I gained are so much better then getting cancer from a can.
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so i know everybody is different, but has anybody besides me seen a reduction in appetite?
on day 25 now, but the first 2 weeks, i had to force myself to eat. most food didn't taste good. i have actually lost 10lbs in these 25 days.
now i can eat and food tastes better, but the quantity i have been has seemed to be cut in half. i just don't seem to want to eat as much.
please forgive my ramblings and incoherence as i am fight a severe case of the fog/suck right now.
Yes. That could be because I started out sick, but while most seem to report appetite increases, yes mine decreased I didn't want to eat nearly as much.
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so i know everybody is different, but has anybody besides me seen a reduction in appetite?
on day 25 now, but the first 2 weeks, i had to force myself to eat. most food didn't taste good. i have actually lost 10lbs in these 25 days.
now i can eat and food tastes better, but the quantity i have been has seemed to be cut in half. i just don't seem to want to eat as much.
please forgive my ramblings and incoherence as i am fight a severe case of the fog/suck right now.
Yes. That could be because I started out sick, but while most seem to report appetite increases, yes mine decreased I didn't want to eat nearly as much.
So long as your appetite is coming back you got no worries. Lots of people gain weight, but others lose it. The most important thing for now is staying quit. Losing or gaining weight is a lot easier than losing cancer...
P.S. Try some fast food if the 10 lbs was not wanting to be lost, but if it was extra insulation just count your blessings...
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Anybody else get tension headaches? I have had tension in the back of my neck up to the base of my skull for the past few days. Really getting annoying. Going on day 4 now.
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I dont get the headaches so much but i do feel like im on the constant verge of a heartattack. The anxiety SUCKS! It has me on the couch just full of worry. Someone did tell me though that they went to the hospital twice during their quit with false chest pains. Nicotine is absolutely ridiculous in how it manifests the quit symptoms differnetly in people.
Take some tylenol and stay strong
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I dont get the headaches so much but i do feel like im on the constant verge of a heartattack. The anxiety SUCKS! It has me on the couch just full of worry. Someone did tell me though that they went to the hospital twice during their quit with false chest pains. Nicotine is absolutely ridiculous in how it manifests the quit symptoms differnetly in people.
Take some tylenol and stay strong
The anxiety is the absolute worst! I didn't end up at the hospital for it, but did end up going to the doc more times in the first month or two than I had in years ended up with meds for anxiety. Stay strong indeed! The quit symptoms might seem fairly universal but yes they manifest themselves in different ways in different guys all the time.
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I dont get the headaches so much but i do feel like im on the constant verge of a heartattack. The anxiety SUCKS! It has me on the couch just full of worry. Someone did tell me though that they went to the hospital twice during their quit with false chest pains. Nicotine is absolutely ridiculous in how it manifests the quit symptoms differnetly in people.
I agree with Grizzfall. I had a bad (what i now know was anxiety) attack at work. I work in a front of a 450 degree oven in a nearly 100 degree factory. I got real dizzy and shaky and my heart was speeding off the charts. Damn near passed out trying to find someone to help me.
I went and saw my doctor to see what was up. Never even considered it to be withdrawal. Anyway be weary if you do see a doctor. I ended up getting multiple tests done on my heart because of a family history. These including cheap (in comparison) blood tests, to a $400 echo cardiogram and a $3000 transesophageal echo cardiogram. Im not saying to rule anything out but over $4000 worth of visits and tests just to tell me it was anxiety is friggin ridiculous.
And you do NOT want the transesophageal test. They make you gurgle (or make a terrible attempt to) a numbing paste that has the consistency of molasses. Then they drug you up and shove a giant black dildo down your throat. Your "not suppose to feel it," but my drugs hadnt kicked in and I ended up puking all over myself. Not fun at all.
As for your other post, I have gained 40 pounds since quitting. :(
Glad to be quit with you,
Dave - 73 days
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today is day 49 for me, and by far the worst day i have had yet! man this sucks.
just totally feel like shit today! fog, random panic/anxiety, chills, tense, etc.
gonna go for a walk...
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today is day 49 for me, and by far the worst day i have had yet! man this sucks.
just totally feel like shit today! fog, random panic/anxiety, chills, tense, etc.
gonna go for a walk...
Hope the walk helps Stew! Congrats on making it to day 49, that's an awesome accomplishment! While it does get easier, even at day 55 yesterday, I was still struggling. Guys tell me it can take 150 days to start feeling normal healed. Hang in there bro, you've got this!
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today is day 49 for me, and by far the worst day i have had yet! man this sucks.
just totally feel like shit today! fog, random panic/anxiety, chills, tense, etc.
gonna go for a walk...
Here is part of my timeline I keep for myself.
Notice how day 31-60 just really sucked for me. The good news is it got way easier at day 61 and has been pretty easy since then.
Day 31-38: Freaking fog was back, some nasty craves and my temper way out of control. WTF!
Day 39-60: The roller coaster days. Mod craves followed by no craves, bad temper and mild depression. A difficult time but I was not giving up at this point.
Day 61-73: The best days by far. Seldom think about dip, temper is way better, sleeping like a normal person and just feeling pretty darn good. I am stacking up these good days to recharge my batteries and prepare for the next round of fights".
Day 74- 85: Really good days. Strong cravings when I have too many drinks so I have been careful with drinking. Normal days are now 0-1 crave. My temper has been completely under control for 2 weeks now.
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today is day 49 for me, and by far the worst day i have had yet! man this sucks.
just totally feel like shit today! fog, random panic/anxiety, chills, tense, etc.
gonna go for a walk...
Here is part of my timeline I keep for myself.
Notice how day 31-60 just really sucked for me. The good news is it got way easier at day 61 and has been pretty easy since then.
Day 31-38: Freaking fog was back, some nasty craves and my temper way out of control. WTF!
Day 39-60: The roller coaster days. Mod craves followed by no craves, bad temper and mild depression. A difficult time but I was not giving up at this point.
Day 61-73: The best days by far. Seldom think about dip, temper is way better, sleeping like a normal person and just feeling pretty darn good. I am stacking up these good days to recharge my batteries and prepare for the next round of fights".
Day 74- 85: Really good days. Strong cravings when I have too many drinks so I have been careful with drinking. Normal days are now 0-1 crave. My temper has been completely under control for 2 weeks now.
Get some rigorous exercise to help with anxiety.
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...
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Day 119 and that nic bitch is back fucking with me again. Almost had me negotiating with her. Told her to fuck off and moved on.
'finger point'
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Day 119 and that nic bitch is back fucking with me again. Almost had me negotiating with her. Told her to fuck off and moved on.
'finger point'
Nice work. Fuck that bitch.
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Day 119 and that nic bitch is back fucking with me again. Almost had me negotiating with her. Told her to fuck off and moved on.
'finger point'
Nice work. Fuck that bitch.
Welcome.
It's good to see another nicotine addict taking his freedom back from the nic bitch!
Cheers. You can do this.
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Day 119 and that nic bitch is back fucking with me again. Almost had me negotiating with her. Told her to fuck off and moved on.
'finger point'
Nice work. Fuck that bitch.
Welcome.
It's good to see another nicotine addict taking his freedom back from the nic bitch!
Cheers. You can do this.
Thanks for posting this- it helps so those of us behind you in days know what to expect. Way to stay strong with the bitch too! Quit with you.
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Need advise from those that have been there. 120+ days and still dealing with strong bouts of anxiety. Pretty much shuts me down. Prior to quitting, I have never had any issues with anxiety.
To deal with this, the Dr. put me on Wellbutrin XL, tried it for a month but it had no affect. Next we tried Buspirone. Up to 7.5 mg three times a day. Seemed to work a little, but this past week (the holidays) it has not been working. Found myself at Chicfila at lunch today with the kid and it was a mad house. As soon as we walked in i started freaking out, i just had to get out of there. Prior to the quit it wouldnt have been an issue. I also have been having some side effects that I am associating with the Buspirone and I want to try something else.
Wondering what others have tried and how it worked for you?
Got a Dr appt on Monday.
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stew, I'm no doctor but you seem to be looking for ideas so I'll offer this thought. If you're anxiety is mild, 30 minutes of exercise a day could make an amazing difference in your life. Helps with the quit too. Check out the book Spark by John J Ratey MD.
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Preface: I'm not a doctor.
But...I'm 572 days quit and still have anxiety issues that were not there prior to quitting. Still learning to deal with life minus my "crutch".
As stated, exercise helps greatly, but on the medical front I still use "spot" or quick acting anti anxiety meds. I use klonopin (clonazepam). It works fast, but I only take it when I really feel I'm in a panicy pinch...like you in Chic Fila. I'm very careful to only take it as needed...
Not saying this is your solution, or that it will work for you, but may be something to bring up to the doctor.
Also, cbt, or talk therapy helps a great deal as well. Perhaps your doc can recommend a good counselor. I use one and she is very helpful.
Again, I'm not a professional. Just giving my 2 cents. Hang in there bro and keep fighting!!!
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stew, I'm no doctor but you seem to be looking for ideas so I'll offer this thought. If you're anxiety is mild, 30 minutes of exercise a day could make an amazing difference in your life. Helps with the quit too. Check out the book Spark by John J Ratey MD.
If your not on a daily exercise regiment I highly recommend it. It will do wonders. Eating right and exercising will help you mentally and physically.
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Like the others, I'm no doctor, but will qualify myself as a licensed pharmacist. I commend your doctor for starting with the Wellbutrin XL, this is the same drug/chemical (bupropion) as "Zyban", which was one of the first non-nicotine replacement therapies used for smoking addiction. Bupropion is an antidepressant, somewhat effective in quelling withdrawal symptoms from nicotine cessation. Buspar (buspirone) is an older medication used for anxiety. It's also somewhat effective, but less effective than benzodiazepines such as Ativan (lorazepam), Xanax (alprazolam), and Klonopin (clonazepam). The advantage to buspirone is that it is less habit forming than the benzos, so again, I see the logic in the approach your physician has taken.
What makes your case interesting is that you're 120 days into your quit. Your anxiety may be related to the lack of nicotine, but to me, it sounds like it's more like an underlying anxiety. The following is merely an opinion, and do not take it for a diagnosis. 4 months ago and beyond, you were self treating anxiety with nicotine. Any situation that brought on feelings of anxiety could be alleviated by throwing in a nice fat lipper. Well, now you don't have that crutch (or should I say that nasty, life-sucking bitch), you need to rely on something to help you with you're anxiety.
I think you should talk to your doctor about 2 things. 1) short-term treatment for anxiety episodes and ask if a benzodiazepine would be appropriate 2) long-term treatment for anxiety. This is commonly treated with an antidepressant in the SSRI (selective-seretoninin reuptake inhibitor) classÂ…common ones include: Zoloft (sertraline), Prozac (fluoxetine), Paxil (paroxetine), Celexa (citalopram), and Lexapro (escitalopram). They're all available as generics and are pretty cheap with the exception of escitalopram. If I had to pick to to ask about, I would ask about setraline and citalopram.
Good luck and like all other things, take this ODAAT.
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Thanks for all the help. Doc giving me clonazepam to get through the initial load up of Celexa. Once that has time to build up I will stop the clonazepam. After about 3/4 months (if all is good) we will see about stepping down off the Celexa.
It just sucks because everything in my life is good and I have no reason to be going through this other than the lack of dip.
I will be augmenting this with my workout that I started back this weekend. I was working out regularly during the early stages of my quit, but time change made it difficult after work. No more excuses.
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Found this to be an interesting discussion. I am on Day 60 of quit, but also have struggled with anxiety issues. Very often, the "I just need to get out of here" issue you mentioned. Hard to say what triggers it as it has changed over the years. Lately has been work meetings, which is not good for job future when you can't make the most of meetings. I also used to use Nicotine as what I thought would help anxiety. Dips before meetings and eventually got to Nicotine gum that you could chew at any time. In retrospect believe that the nicotine made things worse; after all, it is a stimulant. I've tried several of the anti-depressants Steakbomb18 noted below, but have had better success with amitryptylene which is an older drug but less side effects for me.
My one word of caution would be with the Klonopin. When I was having really bad panic attacks in my early to mid twenties, I was prescribed Xanax daily. It definitely helped the anxiety, but the habit forming qualities of the opiates is incredibly real. I tried stopping that cold turkey and it felt like what I imagined a heroin withdrawal would feel like. In retrospect, I think something like Xanax or Klonopin could be helpful for very short term anxiety, like panic attacks, but just be careful with it. If you can get addicted to nicotine, Xanax or klonopin is definitely something to be careful with.
Also big proponent of working out regularly. it's helped with my nicotine quit, but also good for depression/anxiety. I have gotten into Spinning lately at my Ymca and I love it for cardio.
Good luck and feel free to PM and I can give you my number for texting.
Also looking back at one of your thoughts that this shouldn't be happening other than for lack of dip. I completely agree with the thought but from my experience not sure what to believe. Addiction/Anxiety appear to have a strong hereditary, which in my case is strongly supported by my father's side of family. Just my 2 cents. I am not a doctor either but seem to suffer from similar issues that aren't logical in my brain. Best of luck and hope to here how things progress!
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Found this to be an interesting discussion. I am on Day 60 of quit, but also have struggled with anxiety issues. Very often, the "I just need to get out of here" issue you mentioned. Hard to say what triggers it as it has changed over the years. Lately has been work meetings, which is not good for job future when you can't make the most of meetings. I also used to use Nicotine as what I thought would help anxiety. Dips before meetings and eventually got to Nicotine gum that you could chew at any time. In retrospect believe that the nicotine made things worse; after all, it is a stimulant. I've tried several of the anti-depressants Steakbomb18 noted below, but have had better success with amitryptylene which is an older drug but less side effects for me.
My one word of caution would be with the Klonopin. When I was having really bad panic attacks in my early to mid twenties, I was prescribed Xanax daily. It definitely helped the anxiety, but the habit forming qualities of the opiates is incredibly real. I tried stopping that cold turkey and it felt like what I imagined a heroin withdrawal would feel like. In retrospect, I think something like Xanax or Klonopin could be helpful for very short term anxiety, like panic attacks, but just be careful with it. If you can get addicted to nicotine, Xanax or klonopin is definitely something to be careful with.
Also big proponent of working out regularly. it's helped with my nicotine quit, but also good for depression/anxiety. I have gotten into Spinning lately at my Ymca and I love it for cardio.
Good luck and feel free to PM and I can give you my number for texting.
Also looking back at one of your thoughts that this shouldn't be happening other than for lack of dip. I completely agree with the thought but from my experience not sure what to believe. Addiction/Anxiety appear to have a strong hereditary, which in my case is strongly supported by my father's side of family. Just my 2 cents. I am not a doctor either but seem to suffer from similar issues that aren't logical in my brain. Best of luck and hope to here how things progress!
I agree I find this discussion interesting. If anyone is interested there's a anxiety and depression section in the wildcards. For me depression and anxiety went hand in hand with my addiction. Unlike many that got depressed or anxiety after quitting nicotine my experience was the opposite, nicotine seemed to make my depression worse. Now that I've been nicotine free for a considerable period of time I'm finding that my meds need to be fine tuned.
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I understood the addition risk associated with the konoplin. As a result, I have been taking half of what he prescribed and been quit well the past few days. Going to take it a step further and cut back some more.
For reference, prescribed 1mg 2 x a day. I am breaking them in half and only taking 1 mg total for the day. That seems to be working for me as I have not had an ounce of anxeity since I started 5 days ago (Tuesday). Going to skip the second half tonight and see how that goes tonight.
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I'm going to caveat that the following info is about pharmacologic treatment of anxiety. I am a full proponent of non-medicinal treatments as first-line and supplemental therapy to anxiety/stress reduction (i.e. diet, exercise, relaxation techniques).
Taking the 1/2 tablet or 0.5 mg of clonazepam is still a therapeutic dose (it's even supplied as a 0.5 mg tablet), and as needed use is also an appropriate way to use the drug. These drugs are less habit forming when used to treat the condition for which they were prescribed (more habit forming when used for recreation), but they are still habit forming as y'all have suggested. If you look back to my original post the key to long-term anxiety treatment is the use of an anti-depressant, which it appears you have gone down the Celexa (citalopram) route. The amitriptyline George noted is also an antidepressant (much older). This treatment course is safer and comes with improved outcomes. Typically, once you have the anxiety / stress triggers under control, you can begin to wean from the drug therapy. Antidepressants affect neurochemicals, hence weaning is used to prevent side effects (they're not poisonous like nicotine/dip so we don't have to cold turkey quit).
I offer this as an outsider's point-of-view, only to give you some additional information; if it's too much or off point, just let me know. I think you're doing / thinking about this the right way and more importantly I'm glad to be quitting with you EDD.
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Interesting discussion about post quit anxiety and depression.
Here is my story, I will try to be brief.
Quit Jan 2013
Around day 40 severe depression. Worked through it and was doing OK.
Had medical issue and surgery late May.
Had complications from surgery.
Extreme anxiety, stress, worry.
July dental visit for routine cleaning and to talk about future crown work due to lifetime of teeth grinding. I broke down and told him I was about to start dipping again due to all the anxiety, stress, and worry. He wrote me a 30 pill prescription for Valium (diazepam).
Note: I grind more post quit.
Stretched 30 pills over 3 months.
Tried to renew Valium prescription through regular doctor, refused and prescribed me Zoloft.
Researched Zoloft, scares me.
Was able to get 10 more Valium pills and stretched over a month.
Had additional surgery Nov.
Was able to get 10 more valium pills after surgery and I have 4 1/2 left.
Additional research on Zoloft, still scares me.
Oh, due to surgeries can't exercise. This happening to someone who had a pre surgery and pre quit resting heart rate or 45 bpm is also taking a toll mentally and emotionally.
What scares me about Zoloft?
Mainly suicide - already have thought about it, don't need a pill that may promote it and actually lower my inhibitions to do it.
Then there is the insomnia - have trouble enough sleeping as it is, tried all the cbt , did not work, ended up taking Ambien.
Have read about "brain zaps", stomach cramping, weight gain, loss of libido, loss of emotions (zombie), fidgeting, involuntary muscle movements, jerking, actual increases in anxiety.
So, what are my choices?
In the end, the one pill that actually makes me feel better I cannot get. I can always try "doctor shopping" but no guarantees. So I stay the course and battle extreme anxiety and stress the rest of my life, how ever long or short that may be, which basically is making my life a living hell. But hey I am quit right and that is the number one thing right?
Or trying the Zoloft and dealing with all the side effects that come and hopefully not committing suicide and it may or may not work. In which case if it does not I went through all the side effects for nothing. But hey I stayed quit and that is the number one thing right? And if it does help me what happens when the doc says I don't need it anymore? What I've read is rebound anxiety, brain zaps, etc that take months to get over and you end up back where you started.
Or start dipping again. But that is a nono. The quit is the most important thing, I must stay quit to save my life even if it kills me or makes my life a living hell or I kill myself doing it. At least I will have died "free"....