I don't know where in the hell it came from and who brainwashed who into believing that if you cave you are an incredible failure.. doomed to a life of dread and groveling to be accepted again into this fold.. thank God I have not caved in 53 days.. If i did after seeing what I have seen here, it is highly unlikely I would come back here for support.. because when someone does cave I don't see a lot of support I see a lot of shit giving!Â
Take a look around, bro. Some of the biggest badasses on here are former cavers.
We post a promise each day to stay quit, that is the premise of this program. If you break your promise and cave, those of us who kept our word, our honor, and our quit are justifiably vexed. You're suggesting we should shrug it off and welcome a caver back immediately with open arms, with no conditions?
I don't want KTC to be like that. Accountability, honor, and the fact that I'd let down and piss off a group of guys that I have a ton of respect for . . . is one of the things that galvanizes my quit. And theirs, I suspect.
Stay strong, and stick around. You can tune out the drama, just stay quit.
I thought the same way. I can tell you after 143 days, I don't plan to cave. If I did, I would come to KTC and take my deserved beatings. Why? Vets save lives
Then I would say you falsely led us to believe you were a man of your word to begin with. If you could not own up to a cave, how can you look yourself in the mirror and respect who you see looking back.
If one of my kids fucks up and admits it to me, a couple of things are going to happen:
1) They are going to hear about it and be reprimanded for it.
2) They are always going to know where their father stands and what he stands for
3) I am going to have an increased level of respect for them for the integrity they've shown even though that integrity results in them being reprimanded for their actions
'clap'
That's pretty bad ass. I heard somewhere, "reprove at times with sharpness, afterwords showing an increase of love lest they esteem you an enemy."
Cavers deserve to be broken down before they are built back up because there is NEVER a valid reason for caving, just addict excuses. The caver not only broke a promise to themselves, they broke a promise to all of us if they posted roll.
While the peer support here is an awesome thing, I don't believe peer pressure alone will not keep someone from caving. Personal integrity is what will keep you quit in the long run. And when someone caves they prove at least temporarily they are without integrity.
Yes, some on the site do "pile on", I suspect in part because of nic rage. But the more sage and experienced supporters are simply trying to get the caver to understand exactly where and how they failed so they can avoid the same failure in the future.
I am a failure.
I was handed the keys to freedom once, and I stopped rather easily in perspective. My physical pain was Much less than the emotional pain I was feeling at the time (my mom was dying of cancer). All these crappy quitting feelings got all messed up with my mourning. I tried my best to sweep everything under the rug and I lost perspective.
My original group is December 2006. They are posting numbers in the 2200s. I posted 401 today.
When I returned, I was stupid. I pulled the same Fucking shenanigans these guys did initially. I thought I was special and needed drugs to keep me happy to stay quit. Nicotine was too Much a part of my life. These fuckers with 150 days named gmann and 30 yraddict knew nothing about "long time Quitting". I knew there was trouble after 150 days and they weren't homefree. Why were they talking down to me like I'm an idiotic?
Instead of pouting and doing it my way, I grabbed as many new guys to support with me as I could. I stood up for every Fucking caver, and I was the first in line if/when that person fucked up. I admitted my mistakes, and although I regretted them, I learned from them. I learned that memory is arbitrary to state of mind. If you feel good, you forget the bad. I learned that I had to practice for the bad in times of good, and lean on my tools in times of bad.
The reason I "get a pass" (as some have put it) is that I have walked the walk everyday. I have yet to miss roll, and I stay active here. I don't do this because of you guys. I do this for me. I know this program will keep me quit and I want to make sure I will never fail again. Walking someone off the ledge makes my quit stronger. Pointing out flawed logic does the same. Seeing badasses like Mccarmo and coach Steve take words I said to them 200 days ago and craft it into unbelievable support is absolutely wonderful and makes my quit Fucking strong as hell.
If you'll ever notice, most of the time, the very first post post cave is somebody asking the 3 questions. The bullshit and piling on happen when that caver ignores the questions or gives bullshit answers without fully admitting "I fucked up and chose to use". Those 3 questions are the first step. After that, they'll walk the walk if they learned anything at all.
