day 11

[CoachDoc]

From a medical standpoint, it is not the nicotine that causes the cancer, it is all of the other chemicals within the tobacco that does that.  Nicotine is a drug - an addictive drug  - and is used regularly in the medical field in safe and therapeutic ways.  Tobacco on the other hand, is a drug BECAUSE of the nicotine, but is not used in medical treatment because it is also responsible for causing cancer.

Take the nic out of tobacco and it is no longer a drug, yet it will still cause cancer and kill you.  And if they tell you they take all the cancer causing elements out of tobacco, they are either liars or it isn't tobacco. 

Fake dip can be helpful in dealing with the physical need of a pinch that, to some (I find myself among these), is a large part of the addiction - the oral fixation.  People use seeds, fake dip, candy, mints and all sorts of other things to help get over the need to have something in their mouth.  In my opinion, as long as it isn't something that is going to kill you and doesn't have nic, it should be looked at as a positive thing.  But remember, over use of candy can result in diabetes, overeating can lead to obesity and heart disease and diabetes.  Moderation is a good thing.

My issue with herbal is this - if I continue to mimic the same behavior what is to prevent me from progressing just a little further into the "real" thing? ...

I am not trying to argue that one position is correct and the other incorrect I just want folks to know, especially newbies, that it might not be for everyone.

I absolutely agree with you on this...what works for me isn't necessarily the right thing for you (or another quitter). My original point was to the specific post about "nicotine-free tobacco." There is, in no way, a benefit from using tobacco simply because it doesn't have nicotine.

[Show]

From a medical standpoint, it is not the nicotine that causes the cancer, it is all of the other chemicals within the tobacco that does that.  Nicotine is a drug - an addictive drug  - and is used regularly in the medical field in safe and therapeutic ways.  Tobacco on the other hand, is a drug BECAUSE of the nicotine, but is not used in medical treatment because it is also responsible for causing cancer.

Take the nic out of tobacco and it is no longer a drug, yet it will still cause cancer and kill you.  And if they tell you they take all the cancer causing elements out of tobacco, they are either liars or it isn't tobacco. 

Fake dip can be helpful in dealing with the physical need of a pinch that, to some (I find myself among these), is a large part of the addiction - the oral fixation.  People use seeds, fake dip, candy, mints and all sorts of other things to help get over the need to have something in their mouth.  In my opinion, as long as it isn't something that is going to kill you and doesn't have nic, it should be looked at as a positive thing.  But remember, over use of candy can result in diabetes, overeating can lead to obesity and heart disease and diabetes.  Moderation is a good thing.

My issue with herbal is this - if I continue to mimic the same behavior what is to prevent me from progressing just a little further into the "real" thing? For instance, being a recovering alcoholic I avoid NA beers. Why not drink an NA? After all, it is the alcohol, or rather the effects of that alcohol on my state of being that I am addicted to. However, I tried NA once upon a time and I found myself pounding them. I had a six pack and pounded them inside of two hours....why?

Not sure but I guarantee it was not healthy.

When I first bought the herbal chew, I was Pavlovian in my reaction to the entire ritual of putting in a mint chew. From the sliding my finger nail through the paper and under the lid to open it to the pack to the process I use to place it (hold the lip out with the pinkie and use the others to slide it in) to the wiping of the hands it was giddy with anticipation. Then, throughout the day, I found myself acting just like I did with real chew. Spit one out, throw in another. Spit one out, throw in another.........etc..

Then I ran out......talk about pissed. I might as well have run out of real chew with how I reacted. Threw a tantrum like a little kid.

I am not trying to argue that one position is correct and the other incorrect I just want folks to know, especially newbies, that it might not be for everyone. For me fake chew is too close to the real thing. I will stick to seeds, gum and life savers for now.

[CoachDoc]

From a medical standpoint, it is not the nicotine that causes the cancer, it is all of the other chemicals within the tobacco that does that. Nicotine is a drug - an addictive drug - and is used regularly in the medical field in safe and therapeutic ways. Tobacco on the other hand, is a drug BECAUSE of the nicotine, but is not used in medical treatment because it is also responsible for causing cancer.

Take the nic out of tobacco and it is no longer a drug, yet it will still cause cancer and kill you. And if they tell you they take all the cancer causing elements out of tobacco, they are either liars or it isn't tobacco.

Fake dip can be helpful in dealing with the physical need of a pinch that, to some (I find myself among these), is a large part of the addiction - the oral fixation. People use seeds, fake dip, candy, mints and all sorts of other things to help get over the need to have something in their mouth. In my opinion, as long as it isn't something that is going to kill you and doesn't have nic, it should be looked at as a positive thing. But remember, over use of candy can result in diabetes, overeating can lead to obesity and heart disease and diabetes. Moderation is a good thing.

[nkt]

I read an article on the web that states scientist in japan have successfully removed the gene responsible for nicotine in tobacco plants. Would you go back to dipping if they made a nicotine free dip or chew? The kind of chew or dip that doesn't have a habit along with it, say you could kill the can without any sign of withdrawal..would you do it???

If you suck a cock with a rubber on, does it still count as sucking a cock or sucking a rubber. My opinion is that you are a cocksucker.






No...I wouldn't chew nic-less tobacco.

lol..good point

but that brings up an interesting point. How would tobacco sans the nicotine be any different than say mint snuff? On some level I agree with you Greg but more in the same way I have always had a bit of a problem with the herbal snuff thing. Both are a substitute but I would rather remove it than replace it. Now having said that dissturbbed, that is just one man's take. If herbal chew keeps you from dipping tobacco then use the shit out of it - just be careful, it is not without it's own pitfalls.

No tobacco..!!! with or without Nic. Fuck those people, they have fucked me long enough.

At 420 days free my answer is "NO" I would not dip nicotine free tobacco or any other form of placebo-dip. For those in the early stages of their quits, it might have a place. I wonder though how much of tobacco's cancer-causing effect is driven by nicotine and how much by other chemicals... no nic doesn't necessarily mean harmless, just not as horribly addictive.

I used the fake stuff to take advantage of a trigger I developed over years of dipping. My mind associated putting a pinches of shredded leafy shit in my mouth with feeling good. That trigger continued after I removed the nicotine, but it faded with time once it was no longer reinforced by the nicotine. For me, the "feel good" trigger of the dipping act has been used up and I no longer have any use for placebo-dip.

[Greg5280]

I read an article on the web that states scientist in japan have successfully removed the gene responsible for nicotine in tobacco plants. Would you go back to dipping if they made a nicotine free dip or chew? The kind of chew or dip that doesn't have a habit along with it, say you could kill the can without any sign of withdrawal..would you do it???

If you suck a cock with a rubber on, does it still count as sucking a cock or sucking a rubber. My opinion is that you are a cocksucker.






No...I wouldn't chew nic-less tobacco.

lol..good point

but that brings up an interesting point. How would tobacco sans the nicotine be any different than say mint snuff? On some level I agree with you Greg but more in the same way I have always had a bit of a problem with the herbal snuff thing. Both are a substitute but I would rather remove it than replace it. Now having said that dissturbbed, that is just one man's take. If herbal chew keeps you from dipping tobacco then use the shit out of it - just be careful, it is not without it's own pitfalls.

No tobacco..!!! with or without Nic. Fuck those people, they have fucked me long enough.

[Show]

I read an article on the web that states scientist in japan have successfully removed the gene responsible for nicotine in tobacco plants. Would you go back to dipping if they made a nicotine free dip or chew? The kind of chew or dip that doesn't have a habit along with it, say you could kill the can without any sign of withdrawal..would you do it???

If you suck a cock with a rubber on, does it still count as sucking a cock or sucking a rubber. My opinion is that you are a cocksucker.






No...I wouldn't chew nic-less tobacco.

lol..good point

but that brings up an interesting point. How would tobacco sans the nicotine be any different than say mint snuff? On some level I agree with you Greg but more in the same way I have always had a bit of a problem with the herbal snuff thing. Both are a substitute but I would rather remove it than replace it. Now having said that dissturbbed, that is just one man's take. If herbal chew keeps you from dipping tobacco then use the shit out of it - just be careful, it is not without it's own pitfalls.

[dissturbbed]

I read an article on the web that states scientist in japan have successfully removed the gene responsible for nicotine in tobacco plants. Would you go back to dipping if they made a nicotine free dip or chew? The kind of chew or dip that doesn't have a habit along with it, say you could kill the can without any sign of withdrawal..would you do it???

If you suck a cock with a rubber on, does it still count as sucking a cock or sucking a rubber. My opinion is that you are a cocksucker.






No...I wouldn't chew nic-less tobacco.

lol..good point

[greg40]

I read an article on the web that states scientist in japan have successfully removed the gene responsible for nicotine in tobacco plants. Would you go back to dipping if they made a nicotine free dip or chew? The kind of chew or dip that doesn't have a habit along with it, say you could kill the can without any sign of withdrawal..would you do it???

If you suck a cock with a rubber on, does it still count as sucking a cock or sucking a rubber. My opinion is that you are a cocksucker.




No...I wouldn't chew nic-less tobacco.

[dissturbbed]

I read an article on the web that states scientist in japan have successfully removed the gene responsible for nicotine in tobacco plants. Would you go back to dipping if they made a nicotine free dip or chew? The kind of chew or dip that doesn't have a habit along with it, say you could kill the can without any sign of withdrawal..would you do it???

[loot]

this sucks....but worth it

You are correct, but it only sucks for a little while and then it gets much better.

damn does it ever get better....

[SeattleCJ]

this sucks....but worth it

You are correct, but it only sucks for a little while and then it gets much better.

[dissturbbed]

this sucks....but worth it