I quit, or have I?

[FkSkoal]

I was a young aspiring neuroscientist for a while, but I don't see the point you're trying to make with the neuroscience angle, either. No, we're not wired all the same way, but there's an overarching principle to this site, and it's an effective one at achieving what really should be every tobacco user's goal: to put it in the rearview. It's just not a good habit to have, addict or 'casual'.

Our initial advice was very much the same: "Why take the risk?" I don't see why we're veering so far away from that into science and semantics.

I'm not going to dignify the posts by some of the inflammatory messages to me in this thread with direct, individual responses. They come across as so angry that it sounds like they are in day 3 of their quit. Pseudo-intellectual, blah blah blah. But you have been reasonable and open to discussion.

To me, discussing neuroscience is not an angle or semantics- simply a point of discussion relevant to why we're all here. To deny this element and the small victories that are won each day in this field - largely unnoticed by the public - is actually in my opinion taking two steps back in terms of sending big tobacco a message. The fact remains that although this is a cold turkey site, not everyone is built to do it. There are myriad success stories of people using alternative weaning methods- we should not tolerate it on this site, but we should not act like we're better than them, either. We're all wired differently. And that's not even getting into the psychology side of the discussion, which is another issue in and of itself.

The point I guess I'm trying to make is that everyone has different coping mechanisms in their quit. My own quit was called into question in some other thread because I follow accounts on instagram and youtube which glorify dipping. To act as though this has not helped my quit would be a lie.

The OP of this thread came here looking for answers and was instead met with GTFO by some. This is not only the height of douchebaggery, but it exposes people's own insecurities in their quit. Maybe they wish they could also be token dippers, buying a tin once every six months perhaps. Who knows. I'm not here to psychoanalyze anyone. You don't know me and I don't know you. We're all ones and zeros on a screen. Aside from a few discussions, I'm just here to post roll and found the OPs dilemma interesting.

You are the biggest douche I've ever seen on here.
Why are you here?
"Listen man, this site is good for posting roll to keep you on track with your quit. Other than that, you won't find much room for discussion."
You can track your quit on an app on your phone. And you can post roll using a piece of paper and a pencil.

But I don't have a phone nor access to paper and pencil in NYC.

[30yraddict]

Are we a cult? I suppose in some ways we are. Recovery from addiction requires focus. It requires dedication. It requires discipline. It is no surprise to me that some would find our approach cult like. The fact of the matter is addicts are a very predictable bunch, neuroscience be damned. We lie, we rationalize, we find reasons to cave... ANY chance of getting around the truth in order to get a fix will be exploited by an addict. We recover from this not by philosophical arguments, but coming to grips with the truth of our situation, and by finding ways to cope and overcome.

The truth is: we are addicts.
The truth is: We cannot have just one. Not today, not tomorrow, not ever.

You want an example of someone who tried moderation? That would be me. Over the years I knew I needed to quit... so I decided that I would "taper" First I would only dip once a half hour.... tomorrow I would add 5 minutes to that. etc until I was up to 24 hours. Seemed like a VERY logical plan to me, seemed reasonable. seemed foolproof.. You know what the end result was? Every day the craves became more and more intense until I bought a can and practically strapped that fucker to my face like a feed bag. Started out as a can a day dipper, ended up using 2 cans when I threw in the towel. I tried this technique MULTIPLE times, and wondering each time why it turned out to be impossible. The law of addiction states : ""Administration of a drug to an addict will cause reestablishment of chemical dependence upon the addictive substance." That law is the reason why moderation does not work with a drug that is physically addictive... and nicotine is nearly at the top of the list of the MOST physically addictive substances on the planet.

Then there were the times that I actually stopped for a little while... cold turkey. EVERY one of those caves was with the intention of just having one once in a while... I was ALWAYS back to my original usage within a week. The law of addiction bit me in the ass once again.

So you have a choice: Continue to be quit by shutting the door on any possibility of just one. OR Continue to think that you can use nicotine in moderation, which in reality will always be a one way street to the slavery of active addiction.

[Menace]

I'm just checking here but isn't this a NICOTINE FREE QUIT SITE? I don' thinks its a psychologist's office. WTF? To the OP, Dude this site is for addicts who quit nicotine and need support in that quit. Talking about moderation on here is like pissing into the wind if you haven't figured that out yet. FK, man I am not as much of a hardcore maniac as some on here, but your preachy liberal blather is something else. I'm most likely not half as smart as you but dude nicotine is a fucked up drug that kills people and you indulge peeps that come here with psycho babble BS about everyone is different blah blah blah. Well no shit, everyone is different but this is a QUIT SITE! I don't think we need to encourage any other discussion then quitting and how to quit! I'm with Waste, post roll or move on, there are plenty of other folks who need and want help.

[wastepanel]

Post roll or be done here

Please

[Diesel2112]

Yup, as I said, me and the end of a serious long-term relationship don't go together well. I did have to get help during those times. I am past that now, but I still have low points because of it. The low point was what prompted me to start this thread(well ok not past the whole thing, but nothing dire). I was able to strengthen my resolve to stay clean because of it, a low point is not an excuse to use that stuff.

I've had to get help too...when I quit.

If you're looking for any qualifiers to your quit, like after a break up or to study, it ain't gonna happen.

This is black and white. There is no gray area here.

Now obviously if your having irrational thoughts then by all means turn to a higher power.

[Cindy]

Yup, as I said, me and the end of a serious long-term relationship don't go together well. I did have to get help during those times. I am past that now, but I still have low points because of the past which was what prompted me to start this thread(well ok not past the whole thing, but nothing dire). I was able to strengthen my resolve to stay clean because of it, a low point is not an excuse to use that stuff.

Then end your long term relationship with the nic bitch and come here for help. But we don't sorta quit or half ass quit here. We quit like fuck. Cold turkey. No occasional this or that and yes if you cave you catch hell because every day we promise each other that TODAY we will not use nicotine. And we TRUST each other to keep that promise. One day at a time. If you cave you lied. If you lie how can I trust you to be there if I have a weak moment and need to talk to someone. How do I know you won't tell me it's ok to cave just this once? If you stay here you have to post roll and you have to drink the kool aid. If you don't like the way we quit then GTFO

Also. If you are addicted you absolutely cannot ever have nicotine again. If you do you go back to ground zero. That's why when an alcoholic quits they can't even have mouthwash with alcohol in it. And it will get worse every time. If you are not an addict then you shouldn't be here. You don't need us.

[Cindy]

Yup, as I said, me and the end of a serious long-term relationship don't go together well. I did have to get help during those times. I am past that now, but I still have low points because of the past which was what prompted me to start this thread(well ok not past the whole thing, but nothing dire). I was able to strengthen my resolve to stay clean because of it, a low point is not an excuse to use that stuff.

Then end your long term relationship with the nic bitch and come here for help. But we don't sorta quit or half ass quit here. We quit like fuck. Cold turkey. No occasional this or that and yes if you cave you catch hell because every day we promise each other that TODAY we will not use nicotine. And we TRUST each other to keep that promise. One day at a time. If you cave you lied. If you lie how can I trust you to be there if I have a weak moment and need to talk to someone. How do I know you won't tell me it's ok to cave just this once? If you stay here you have to post roll and you have to drink the kool aid. If you don't like the way we quit then GTFO

[R34P3R]

Yup, as I said, me and the end of a serious long-term relationship don't go together well. I did have to get help during those times. I am past that now, but I still have low points because of it. The low point was what prompted me to start this thread(well ok not past the whole thing, but nothing dire). I was able to strengthen my resolve to stay clean because of it, a low point is not an excuse to use that stuff.

[Benjo]

I read that as just hyperbole, but yeah, that is kind of a heavy comment there, man.

If you need real help, get it. Some things you just can't do by yourself, I've been there.

[Cindy]

Yes, apparently you missed a pretty big part of the context. I have quit, cold turky. Its been 6 months. In the past I stopped using because I just lost interest, usually for 6 months at a time. That 6 month mark hit, and the craving kicked in the other night. I came here looking for support to get through the night. I made it very clear I was against the use of the stuff, and supported everyone's mission here. However I did not think that the close minded, 100% commitment with time roll posting was for me. I wanted to open up a discussion about was I really in the wrong having a can every 6 months or when I was in a situation that I was going to either kill my self or someone else if I could not find some comfort?

I never encouraged anyone to try this moderate use thing, I just wanted to talk about it. I did not want to commit to something that should I run into one of those suicidal situations again that I would be banned from going to nicotine to get through the night, and if I broke then I would just hate my self all the more.

I wanted to see if there was anyone who had a success or fail story with using it so sparingly. There was no info anywhere on that kind of thing, because it does not seem to be done. If I, and people like me are ever going to reach a point where we can commit completely, we need to have all the answers, including the stuff I am talking about. And when these questions cross your minds, if you help me answer them, then you will also have the answers.

I thought this was a place that was here to support people in all stages of quitting. Not just for those willing to follow something as strict as what seems to be religious dogma. A few people here helped me, but most were close minded and hostile, who took everything I said waayyyyy out of context and did not read my message as a whole.


Also if you actually took the time to read my posts, I included a good reason to not try doing things in moderation, one I am currently desperately trying to cling to my self to stay quit. If someone acknowledges they have a weakness, and realizes there are a couple situations were use of the stuff could be necessary, we shouldn't be persecuted for being a little different and being willing to think about it. I currently stand by that it is not an option, excluding the afore mentioned dire situation, but I wanted to talk about it. So what happens when people here fail and cave? Do you just berate them and make them feel like shit? That is not support, that is a very toxic environment I don't want to be a part of. A few more GTFOs and I will leave. But I still hope that is not what goes on here, because there is not another place for me to go.

If you are relying on an occasional can of snuff to avoid committing suicide, you probably need to get real help that you can't find here or in a can of snuff. I'm not being ugly I'm being dead serious. I would go to a doctor or psychiatrist because no matter the situation if you are seriously contemplating suicide then you need treatment. Tobacco is not necessary for anything unless you are doing organic insect control on your garden.

[Lipizzaner]

That was a concern I had, and its why I came to a place where people would not sugar coat it. I have set a very strict parameter for my self, only using for a break up, or if its the difference between passing or failing a final. I had hoped that would fly here, as the other sight is a little to gentle. They really just don't seem to be committed. I hope I can find a middle ground somewhere, where people expect you to keep your word and hold you accountable, but also don't make things completely black and white. I just fear about without that support network that the craving will come around and I could find my self more addicted then I thought I was.

This can't be real.
Are you serious with this shit?
"They really just don't seem to be committed"
Exactly. Neither are you. You're made for that place.
By the way, how were you able to gauge their level of commitment in the few minutes since the site was suggested to you, if you've never seen it before? How do you know its too gentle?
This is all bullshit.
Get the fuck out.

[Benjo]

You don't need nicotine. Period.

Just take your thread title here, chop off everything after the comma, and replace it with a period. It's not really that complicated.

[R34P3R]

That was a concern I had, and its why I came to a place where people would not sugar coat it. I have set a very strict parameter for my self, only using for a break up, or if its the difference between passing or failing a final. I had hoped that would fly here, as the other sight is a little to gentle. They really just don't seem to be committed. I hope I can find a middle ground somewhere, where people expect you to keep your word and hold you accountable, but also don't make things completely black and white. I just fear about without that support network that the craving will come around and I could find my self more addicted then I thought I was.

[Benjo]

Yep, I don't know if you need this site or not, but I do think you know you need to not listen to that craving. It's that craving voice that people are being dicks to, most of us probably know it better than you do. No one tries to be an asshole for no reason around here, he's just being the guard dog to keep us safe from heretical thoughts towards nicotine. That's kind of ridiculous, right? Except it's not, really. Tobacco takes lives.

[Diesel2112]

Thanks for the direction, I had not had much luck finding a smokeless site other then this. Ill still check in on this thread since I seem to have started some waves, but it looks like I am probably best moving over there.

You are not different nor the first one to start any "waves" here.

Yeah, go over there. You can stop for awhile and then when you cave everyone will tell you, "it's ok. Never quit quitting". That's what you want to hear anyway.

PLEASE heed my warning though...you're once in awhile cravings can flip into full blown addiction/dependency in a millisecond. The bitch of it is, you won't even know it. You will use addict logic to rationalize your continued use and live in a state of denial for many years.

You're playing with fire son. You're best bet is to throw away the matches.

Good luck to you.