General Discussion - 2017

[JB65]

Anyone else experience unquenchable thirst after quitting? It's my 27th day and all day today and yesterday I have drank lots of water but still felt thirst intensely. The type of thirst where you can feel your mouth salivating. The type of thirst that only really milk and water will quench. Wondering if anyone else has experienced anything of the sort or if my body just needed liquids lately lol.

For sure. I nailed water like crazy the first few months after quitting.

[gottadoit3]

Anyone else experience unquenchable thirst after quitting? It's my 27th day and all day today and yesterday I have drank lots of water but still felt thirst intensely. The type of thirst where you can feel your mouth salivating. The type of thirst that only really milk and water will quench. Wondering if anyone else has experienced anything of the sort or if my body just needed liquids lately lol.

[pky1520]

Thanks guys. I appreciate the motivation. I will post my first Roll Call in the morning. Tired of being so dependent on this stuff. Not as concerned about the effects dip has on me but pissed off that I allowed myself to get this addicted to something.

Awesome man! Thrilled to hear it - the quit will be tough at first, but I guarantee that it will get better and the freedom you'll have will be totally worth the pain.

Don't wait for tomorrow. Dump all of your nicotine products right now and post Day One today! At KTC we count the day you quit as Day 1, so don't wait until tomorrow.

[okc23]

Thanks guys. I appreciate the motivation. I will post my first Roll Call in the morning. Tired of being so dependent on this stuff. Not as concerned about the effects dip has on me but pissed off that I allowed myself to get this addicted to something.

[JB65]

OKC, to a person here, we all face our demons, triggers, temptations and 'reasons' to dip.

PKY is right on. It is up to you to recognize, and decide whether you want to conquer them or continue to be a slave.

I travel every week, lots of flying, long drives in rental cars, hotels at night alone. Talk about opportunities to give in!! The old days that's all I did. Then, I made a decision that I had had enough 692 days ago. And I joined Nov 2015, dove in, exchanged phone numbers with a ton of people here.

And now I am killing it.

However, I am still as susceptible to caving and dipping as I was 692 days ago, but now I have tools, knowledge, promises, accountability, friends, and all sorts of confidence that I can make it each day without a dip.

Dude like many here I 'stopped' hundreds of times in 30 years. But i never 'quit' until I joined Nov 2015.

Are you tired of being a slave? Are you ready to attack this head on? If you are, join Oct 2017 and get active and post your roll promise every day early.

If you arent ready, then you can continue to be a slave, come up with excuses to dip and planned caves.

Tools are here, support is here, your quit is here waiting for you. Are you ready?

[pky1520]

Just joined the group. Read the Forums off and on as motivation for a while. I have been dipping since 2009. I have hid dipping from my wife for almost 3 years. (She knows I have one every now and then but not to the extent that I do.) I have had a few attempts at quitting. My most recent attempt has lasted 15 days so far. It's been tough. I think about it constantly. Driving. Working. Mowing. It's tough. Here is my problem. I am a coach and a teacher and leave next week for Nashville and will be there for 4 days. All expenses paid. Without my wife. It's sad but I am already thinking of the dip I want on the plane rides and at the hotel all by myself all week. To top it all off my superintendent dips and will be offering it to me all week. Please talk me off the ledge and give me some words of advice.

Thanks.

Have you tried fake dip yet? Works for me. Tell your supe you quit and would appreciate it if he keeps it away from you.

Okc23 - do you want to quit? That's the most important question. If you want to quit, you can - regardless of the temptations or the situation.

If you want to try, slow down, taper, think about it, maybe later, test the waters, "Quit again", then this is not the place for you. If that's you, then my advice is to pack a fatty and come back later.

If you saw all of those options and said "FUCK THAT, I'm no punk bitch, I want to QUIT!!!!" Well then brother, do I have the plan for you! Find the October 2017 pre-HOF Quit Group and post a Day 1. Promise you won't use any nicotine product for today. Keep that promise. Wake up tomorrow, and FIRST THING, make that same promise. Keep it.

See where I'm going? I've made that promise every day and today I posted it for Day 432. That number seems impossible to you, but it isn't. You can do that too. It's one day at a time, every freaking day. Make the promise, keep it. It couldn't be more simple - but it won't be easy.

[Blackjp4dr]

Just joined the group. Read the Forums off and on as motivation for a while. I have been dipping since 2009. I have hid dipping from my wife for almost 3 years. (She knows I have one every now and then but not to the extent that I do.) I have had a few attempts at quitting. My most recent attempt has lasted 15 days so far. It's been tough. I think about it constantly. Driving. Working. Mowing. It's tough. Here is my problem. I am a coach and a teacher and leave next week for Nashville and will be there for 4 days. All expenses paid. Without my wife. It's sad but I am already thinking of the dip I want on the plane rides and at the hotel all by myself all week. To top it all off my superintendent dips and will be offering it to me all week. Please talk me off the ledge and give me some words of advice.

Thanks.

Have you tried fake dip yet? Works for me. Tell your supe you quit and would appreciate it if he keeps it away from you.

[okc23]

Just joined the group. Read the Forums off and on as motivation for a while. I have been dipping since 2009. I have hid dipping from my wife for almost 3 years. (She knows I have one every now and then but not to the extent that I do.) I have had a few attempts at quitting. My most recent attempt has lasted 15 days so far. It's been tough. I think about it constantly. Driving. Working. Mowing. It's tough. Here is my problem. I am a coach and a teacher and leave next week for Nashville and will be there for 4 days. All expenses paid. Without my wife. It's sad but I am already thinking of the dip I want on the plane rides and at the hotel all by myself all week. To top it all off my superintendent dips and will be offering it to me all week. Please talk me off the ledge and give me some words of advice.

Thanks.

[Blackjp4dr]

I joined yesterday, my quit date was 8 days ago. I have been doing Copenhagen for 36 years. Ouch! I cannot believe I have not cheated yet. I found Grinds coffee pouches and fell in love with them. These pouches have filled every craving I had. The first 5 days were horrible, sleep wise. I could not sleep at all, sweats, and don't laugh, I think I saw a few ghosts. So glad I found this site. It is awesome. I ordered Baccoff pouches straight and they were horrible. I thought I was going to throw up. I'll stick with the coffee pouches. I think the big thing about finding the oral fixation is not to look for the taste of cope! I am pretending to change flavors so I can't be so critical of the no nicotine no tobacco flavors. Smokey Mountain wintergreen is pretty awesome. Anyway, I know I can do this with the help of all of you. There is so much good info on here that my anxiety is almost nothing. It really helps knowing what others have been through.

[Bill Dance]

if it aint broke.......

[chewie]

Just an observation and suggestion. Not raising a stink for sure. 'winker'

It seems it may be better to limit roll call threads to just roll call posts. The general discussion in between e.g. rants/raves, fun, questions, etc. is easily lost amongst all the roll posts. I miss these general posts if i don't scroll back several pages to see what I missed.

Potentially every quit group should have a roll call thread as well as a general discussion thread. I know we need somewhere other than here in KTC general discussion to collaborate as a quit group but within the roll call thread itself doesn't make sense to me.

October 2017
-Roll Call
-General Discussion
-More Accountability / Contact Information

I'm a newbie so I'm guessing this concern has been raised before and it simply is better the way it is. I don't use forum tools either so that may be part of the problem.

Peace and Tacos

Concur

This does get brought up from time to time, but there are a few reasons that it doesn't happen.
- Many times people might not post, but will still read what's going on in the group and take a lot out of that. Some of those folks might not ever click into the discussion group and would miss out on what's going on.
- Conversely, some folks might just choose to take advantage of Discussion without feeling like they have to get on Roll. Having the Roll posts right there allows you to quickly check to make sure folks are actually making that promise.
- How to police this? Who's going to be in charge of telling people to take conversation off of Roll threads? Moving pickups back over to the roll thread? It just adds a layer of confusion and consternation.
- Picking up new quitters. Sometimes having an immediate response is what gets a new quitter on board. If someone posts a Day One, but doesn't realize there's a separate discussion page, it's possible they'll feel unwelcome because there's no one monitoring the group's roll page.
- Roll-Jacking actually provides a lot of humor and sparks a lot of interactions early on.
- Roll posting is purposefully confusing. It requires that a quitter use their foggy ass brain to focus and actually figure it out. If that's too much for you, then you really aren't prepared for the struggles involved with quitting. New quitters need to put some skin in the game and actually figure it out.
- There are plenty of other discussion and sub-topic tools on this site, so there really should be no shortage of discussion options.
- The main concern is trivializing Roll. Roll is the backbone of the system here and needs to be front and center w/ the groups. Separating it takes visibility away from the promise.

Anyway, it's not a perfect system, but it has worked for the folks here and there is definitely a healthy resistance to anything that might fuck with the secret sauce. I wouldn't bank on a change happening anytime soon.

Thank you for the response. Respectfully, I feel most of these reasons are pretty weak and have obvious mitigations. If anything, much team building is lost with the loss of focused group conversations.

I will say this much; making it difficult to post roll on purpose should certainly be avoided. I'm guessing this reason is actually not an intention of KTC at all.

I don't disagree that it could be streamlined, but KTC is the definition of change averse.

However, if you have some specific suggestions, feel free to voice them here. topic/30193051/1/#new

Cool. Thank ya brother!

'oh yeah'

Just to give some additional (historical?) perspective.

Roll and discussion have been set up this way since this place opened 10+ years ago. Is it perfect? Absolutely not.

In fact, if memory serves me correctly we even tried the multiple threads per group route and have since gone away from it.

We're not making roll difficult on purpose per se, BUT pky is right that we don't want to make it TOO easy. It's been suggested that we make roll call akin to a check box. That's not difficult enough in my book. There needs to be thought that goes into it. After all, it's a promise. It's a decision that needs to be made, by the quitter, daily. It's very important, in my opinion, that there's a "process" there.

That said, we're not completely closed to the idea of changing the way we do roll. In fact, part of it is tied to the software itself. We've had ongoing discussions about if (when) we migrate to a different forum setup we'd also modify how we do roll call. That migration is a complicated issue with several (more than that) moving parts.

I think it's safe to say that both (new software and changes to how we do roll call) are coming, but I think it's also safe to say that pky is right... it won't be too terribly soon.

Chewie

[Brisingr]

Just an observation and suggestion. Not raising a stink for sure. 'winker'

It seems it may be better to limit roll call threads to just roll call posts. The general discussion in between e.g. rants/raves, fun, questions, etc. is easily lost amongst all the roll posts. I miss these general posts if i don't scroll back several pages to see what I missed.

Potentially every quit group should have a roll call thread as well as a general discussion thread. I know we need somewhere other than here in KTC general discussion to collaborate as a quit group but within the roll call thread itself doesn't make sense to me.

October 2017
-Roll Call
-General Discussion
-More Accountability / Contact Information

I'm a newbie so I'm guessing this concern has been raised before and it simply is better the way it is. I don't use forum tools either so that may be part of the problem.

Peace and Tacos

Concur

This does get brought up from time to time, but there are a few reasons that it doesn't happen.
- Many times people might not post, but will still read what's going on in the group and take a lot out of that. Some of those folks might not ever click into the discussion group and would miss out on what's going on.
- Conversely, some folks might just choose to take advantage of Discussion without feeling like they have to get on Roll. Having the Roll posts right there allows you to quickly check to make sure folks are actually making that promise.
- How to police this? Who's going to be in charge of telling people to take conversation off of Roll threads? Moving pickups back over to the roll thread? It just adds a layer of confusion and consternation.
- Picking up new quitters. Sometimes having an immediate response is what gets a new quitter on board. If someone posts a Day One, but doesn't realize there's a separate discussion page, it's possible they'll feel unwelcome because there's no one monitoring the group's roll page.
- Roll-Jacking actually provides a lot of humor and sparks a lot of interactions early on.
- Roll posting is purposefully confusing. It requires that a quitter use their foggy ass brain to focus and actually figure it out. If that's too much for you, then you really aren't prepared for the struggles involved with quitting. New quitters need to put some skin in the game and actually figure it out.
- There are plenty of other discussion and sub-topic tools on this site, so there really should be no shortage of discussion options.
- The main concern is trivializing Roll. Roll is the backbone of the system here and needs to be front and center w/ the groups. Separating it takes visibility away from the promise.

Anyway, it's not a perfect system, but it has worked for the folks here and there is definitely a healthy resistance to anything that might fuck with the secret sauce. I wouldn't bank on a change happening anytime soon.

Thank you for the response. Respectfully, I feel most of these reasons are pretty weak and have obvious mitigations. If anything, much team building is lost with the loss of focused group conversations.

I will say this much; making it difficult to post roll on purpose should certainly be avoided. I'm guessing this reason is actually not an intention of KTC at all.

I don't disagree that it could be streamlined, but KTC is the definition of change averse.

However, if you have some specific suggestions, feel free to voice them here. topic/30193051/1/#new

Cool. Thank ya brother!

'oh yeah'

[pky1520]

Just an observation and suggestion. Not raising a stink for sure. 'winker'

It seems it may be better to limit roll call threads to just roll call posts. The general discussion in between e.g. rants/raves, fun, questions, etc. is easily lost amongst all the roll posts. I miss these general posts if i don't scroll back several pages to see what I missed.

Potentially every quit group should have a roll call thread as well as a general discussion thread. I know we need somewhere other than here in KTC general discussion to collaborate as a quit group but within the roll call thread itself doesn't make sense to me.

October 2017
-Roll Call
-General Discussion
-More Accountability / Contact Information

I'm a newbie so I'm guessing this concern has been raised before and it simply is better the way it is. I don't use forum tools either so that may be part of the problem.

Peace and Tacos

Concur

This does get brought up from time to time, but there are a few reasons that it doesn't happen.
- Many times people might not post, but will still read what's going on in the group and take a lot out of that. Some of those folks might not ever click into the discussion group and would miss out on what's going on.
- Conversely, some folks might just choose to take advantage of Discussion without feeling like they have to get on Roll. Having the Roll posts right there allows you to quickly check to make sure folks are actually making that promise.
- How to police this? Who's going to be in charge of telling people to take conversation off of Roll threads? Moving pickups back over to the roll thread? It just adds a layer of confusion and consternation.
- Picking up new quitters. Sometimes having an immediate response is what gets a new quitter on board. If someone posts a Day One, but doesn't realize there's a separate discussion page, it's possible they'll feel unwelcome because there's no one monitoring the group's roll page.
- Roll-Jacking actually provides a lot of humor and sparks a lot of interactions early on.
- Roll posting is purposefully confusing. It requires that a quitter use their foggy ass brain to focus and actually figure it out. If that's too much for you, then you really aren't prepared for the struggles involved with quitting. New quitters need to put some skin in the game and actually figure it out.
- There are plenty of other discussion and sub-topic tools on this site, so there really should be no shortage of discussion options.
- The main concern is trivializing Roll. Roll is the backbone of the system here and needs to be front and center w/ the groups. Separating it takes visibility away from the promise.

Anyway, it's not a perfect system, but it has worked for the folks here and there is definitely a healthy resistance to anything that might fuck with the secret sauce. I wouldn't bank on a change happening anytime soon.

Thank you for the response. Respectfully, I feel most of these reasons are pretty weak and have obvious mitigations. If anything, much team building is lost with the loss of focused group conversations.

I will say this much; making it difficult to post roll on purpose should certainly be avoided. I'm guessing this reason is actually not an intention of KTC at all.

I don't disagree that it could be streamlined, but KTC is the definition of change averse.

However, if you have some specific suggestions, feel free to voice them here. topic/30193051/1/#new

[Brisingr]

Just an observation and suggestion. Not raising a stink for sure. 'winker'

It seems it may be better to limit roll call threads to just roll call posts. The general discussion in between e.g. rants/raves, fun, questions, etc. is easily lost amongst all the roll posts. I miss these general posts if i don't scroll back several pages to see what I missed.

Potentially every quit group should have a roll call thread as well as a general discussion thread. I know we need somewhere other than here in KTC general discussion to collaborate as a quit group but within the roll call thread itself doesn't make sense to me.

October 2017
-Roll Call
-General Discussion
-More Accountability / Contact Information

I'm a newbie so I'm guessing this concern has been raised before and it simply is better the way it is. I don't use forum tools either so that may be part of the problem.

Peace and Tacos

Concur

This does get brought up from time to time, but there are a few reasons that it doesn't happen.
- Many times people might not post, but will still read what's going on in the group and take a lot out of that. Some of those folks might not ever click into the discussion group and would miss out on what's going on.
- Conversely, some folks might just choose to take advantage of Discussion without feeling like they have to get on Roll. Having the Roll posts right there allows you to quickly check to make sure folks are actually making that promise.
- How to police this? Who's going to be in charge of telling people to take conversation off of Roll threads? Moving pickups back over to the roll thread? It just adds a layer of confusion and consternation.
- Picking up new quitters. Sometimes having an immediate response is what gets a new quitter on board. If someone posts a Day One, but doesn't realize there's a separate discussion page, it's possible they'll feel unwelcome because there's no one monitoring the group's roll page.
- Roll-Jacking actually provides a lot of humor and sparks a lot of interactions early on.
- Roll posting is purposefully confusing. It requires that a quitter use their foggy ass brain to focus and actually figure it out. If that's too much for you, then you really aren't prepared for the struggles involved with quitting. New quitters need to put some skin in the game and actually figure it out.
- There are plenty of other discussion and sub-topic tools on this site, so there really should be no shortage of discussion options.
- The main concern is trivializing Roll. Roll is the backbone of the system here and needs to be front and center w/ the groups. Separating it takes visibility away from the promise.

Anyway, it's not a perfect system, but it has worked for the folks here and there is definitely a healthy resistance to anything that might fuck with the secret sauce. I wouldn't bank on a change happening anytime soon.

Thank you for the response. Respectfully, I feel most of these reasons are pretty weak and have obvious mitigations. If anything, much team building is lost with the loss of focused group conversations.

I will say this much; making it difficult to post roll on purpose should certainly be avoided. I'm guessing this reason is actually not an intention of KTC at all.

[pky1520]

Just an observation and suggestion. Not raising a stink for sure. 'winker'

It seems it may be better to limit roll call threads to just roll call posts. The general discussion in between e.g. rants/raves, fun, questions, etc. is easily lost amongst all the roll posts. I miss these general posts if i don't scroll back several pages to see what I missed.

Potentially every quit group should have a roll call thread as well as a general discussion thread. I know we need somewhere other than here in KTC general discussion to collaborate as a quit group but within the roll call thread itself doesn't make sense to me.

October 2017
-Roll Call
-General Discussion
-More Accountability / Contact Information

I'm a newbie so I'm guessing this concern has been raised before and it simply is better the way it is. I don't use forum tools either so that may be part of the problem.

Peace and Tacos

Concur

This does get brought up from time to time, but there are a few reasons that it doesn't happen.
- Many times people might not post, but will still read what's going on in the group and take a lot out of that. Some of those folks might not ever click into the discussion group and would miss out on what's going on.
- Conversely, some folks might just choose to take advantage of Discussion without feeling like they have to get on Roll. Having the Roll posts right there allows you to quickly check to make sure folks are actually making that promise.
- How to police this? Who's going to be in charge of telling people to take conversation off of Roll threads? Moving pickups back over to the roll thread? It just adds a layer of confusion and consternation.
- Picking up new quitters. Sometimes having an immediate response is what gets a new quitter on board. If someone posts a Day One, but doesn't realize there's a separate discussion page, it's possible they'll feel unwelcome because there's no one monitoring the group's roll page.
- Roll-Jacking actually provides a lot of humor and sparks a lot of interactions early on.
- Roll posting is purposefully confusing. It requires that a quitter use their foggy ass brain to focus and actually figure it out. If that's too much for you, then you really aren't prepared for the struggles involved with quitting. New quitters need to put some skin in the game and actually figure it out.
- There are plenty of other discussion and sub-topic tools on this site, so there really should be no shortage of discussion options.
- The main concern is trivializing Roll. Roll is the backbone of the system here and needs to be front and center w/ the groups. Separating it takes visibility away from the promise.

Anyway, it's not a perfect system, but it has worked for the folks here and there is definitely a healthy resistance to anything that might fuck with the secret sauce. I wouldn't bank on a change happening anytime soon.