A Time to Kill (the can)

[4TheWin]

Okay...Day 4 was pretty okay after a nasty f*cking start...even managed to close the deal on a sales dude I have been trying to hire for almost a year...so the fog can be managed.

Now I have to think about this weekend a little bit....can't think of any major danger situations and should be able to hang out on KTC as much as needed....but still need to be wary...that nic bitch is a sneaky nasty bitch....

[SoccerJack]

Okay so now back to the sh*t I was going to try to cover yesterday...so here is a "how am I doing?" combo report for Days 3 and 4....

So far they have both absolutely sucked. Did not sleep well either night. My brain feels foggy all the time. This morning, on my way to the gym, I missed a f*cking step and fell! Nothing broken but un-f*cking believable. I never fall...balance is excellent...I am blaming the nic bitch. Anyway, that sucked...but I still worked out for about 45 minutes, which is good. Last night I really felt like shit before bed. Cramps, stomach hurt, head hurt...headaches seems pretty constant now...and the cravings are pretty bad too...although I have been cramming seeds or smokey mountain in my mouth pretty much all f*cking day. I have also been pissing almost constantly...probably because I am drinking so much f*cking water.

Anyway, I am also sure I have been a real peach to be around. I have been avoiding as much work interaction as possible, but that is going to catch up with me, as life does not stop just because I quit. I have also had some significant spouse stress, kid stress and work stress things explode in the last 48 hours. All of these have triggered nice craves...but I am actually feeling good because I was ready for the them...and they honestly were manageable. It is more the few minutes when I am sitting there doing nothing that the mind games start...or like I forget for a moment that I am quit...and my brain says "oh, time to go get a dip...now where did you last hide that can..." and then it snaps back and remembers....no f*cking nic for you today baby! (And thank God I don't have a trophy or hidden can somewhere because that would probably have been too much, too easy) It is only fleeting...and also seems to be on my mind sometimes when I wake up...but it does make me wistful for a dip for just a minute which is weird.

On a brighter front, I am so jacked by the KTC site that I also wake up thinking I need to piss and post role...so this place is getting to me.

I still haven't formed any close bonds yet....somethng to work on...but I am here and I am quit for today and I will take it ODAAT.

I would have posted roll at 6:00 AM when I woke up, but I couldn't figure out how to do it with my smart phone...and then the whole morning go pretty f*cked up....but I made it and that is my story and I am moving forward 100% quit!

Hey man. Congratulations on deciding to quit. I was also a ninja dipper and I've been a ninja quitter for 274 days now.
I'm an attorney, and I can tell you that the fog was scary for me. Concentration, focus, and attention to detail are critical to what I do, and I seriously was out of commission in those areas for about 80 days or so.
The next couple months after that were still not great, but at least I could start and finish a project. Concentration and focus were still hard.
It's only been the last 2 months or so where I've really felt my brain kick back into gear.

I tell you all this because I joined this site looking to find out how long I was going to be in the fog. It varies for everyone, but it seems the longer you've dipped, the longer it takes to really get clear of the fog.
Hang in there. Post your promise on December's roll everyday. Don't worry if you spend a whole day in here reading just to fight off craves. Don't worry if you seem a little off your corporate game.
You will get better.

Also, don't read too much into vets coming into December and stirring shit up. First, December has a lot of cavers. We are not going to let them lower the bar for new members. Second, fucking around with new groups is a right of passage. It means we like you.

Jack

[Bulldog0311]

Hey buddy. When you get some time and are fighting those craves jump on and read some of the intros. What you'll see is guys doing exactly what you did. Going through exactly what you went through. Some had it harder. Some had it easier. I used my intro page as a journal to list exactly what I was going through so I could go back in perpetuity and remember. Man it's funny. I don't even recognize myself. That's a different dude.

Don't worry about making connections too much yet. Those will come. You have my digits. If you need anything text or call. Offer up your digits in your Quit group. Ask for others. I can't tell you how many times a random text saved my ass from caving. It's weird at first.:.totally having all these dudes phone numbers but man is it worth it.

[DonkeyMN]

You seem to have that same tenacity to quit as the ones that really want to quit have... good!

Keep after it, you are doing all the right things, exercise, drink water... but understand a couple things

- your work life will suffer, but you have to accept that for a month. do not let that be something that deters you
- you need to tell your wife that you may be a complete mess / asshole for the next 20 days or so (if you haven't already)
- get digits from other people in your group and vets (PM incoming) a text can save a quit real quick

Read like you are and "embrace the suck" - remember this shit because there is no way you want to do this again brother.

IQWYT (I Quit With You Today)

[4TheWin]

Okay so now back to the sh*t I was going to try to cover yesterday...so here is a "how am I doing?" combo report for Days 3 and 4....

So far they have both absolutely sucked. Did not sleep well either night. My brain feels foggy all the time. This morning, on my way to the gym, I missed a f*cking step and fell! Nothing broken but un-f*cking believable. I never fall...balance is excellent...I am blaming the nic bitch. Anyway, that sucked...but I still worked out for about 45 minutes, which is good. Last night I really felt like shit before bed. Cramps, stomach hurt, head hurt...headaches seems pretty constant now...and the cravings are pretty bad too...although I have been cramming seeds or smokey mountain in my mouth pretty much all f*cking day. I have also been pissing almost constantly...probably because I am drinking so much f*cking water.

Anyway, I am also sure I have been a real peach to be around. I have been avoiding as much work interaction as possible, but that is going to catch up with me, as life does not stop just because I quit. I have also had some significant spouse stress, kid stress and work stress things explode in the last 48 hours. All of these have triggered nice craves...but I am actually feeling good because I was ready for the them...and they honestly were manageable. It is more the few minutes when I am sitting there doing nothing that the mind games start...or like I forget for a moment that I am quit...and my brain says "oh, time to go get a dip...now where did you last hide that can..." and then it snaps back and remembers....no f*cking nic for you today baby! (And thank God I don't have a trophy or hidden can somewhere because that would probably have been too much, too easy) It is only fleeting...and also seems to be on my mind sometimes when I wake up...but it does make me wistful for a dip for just a minute which is weird.

On a brighter front, I am so jacked by the KTC site that I also wake up thinking I need to piss and post role...so this place is getting to me.

I still haven't formed any close bonds yet....somethng to work on...but I am here and I am quit for today and I will take it ODAAT.

I would have posted roll at 6:00 AM when I woke up, but I couldn't figure out how to do it with my smart phone...and then the whole morning go pretty f*cked up....but I made it and that is my story and I am moving forward 100% quit!

[worktowin]

Okay, so last night sucked....woke up like every hour...I would say that it is not really cravings that are getting me at this point, it is just that my brain feels "fuzzy". I am having a hard time concentrating and focusing. So it is like I miss the buzz from the f*cking poison but not that I am really craving it....if that makes any sense. Also, I don't think I am being extra irritable...which unfortunately probably means that I am...so sorry world!

Worked out this AM, which is good, and did not eat anything unhealthy yesterday, which is also good. Have not really seen much info about how exercise helps with quitting, but I bet it does. As for food, we will have to watch that, but as long as I stick to my plan I should be okay.

The smokey mountain stuff is not too bad...at least it is something.

Over the 36 or so years I have been addicted to this horrible sh*t, I cannot say how many times I tried to quit. I can remember at least two periods where I was quit for more than a year. What was it that made me go back after all of that time? I know I am getting ahead of myself with that question, but it does imply that I should probably plan on staying hooked up with this support mechanism (and thank God for it) for a long, long time....like maybe forever. During one of my longest, previous quits, I was helped by calling a 1-800 line that was provided to help stop smoking as part of the Ohio tobacco settlement. They shuffled me around a while since they were highly focused on smoking and did not know much about dip, but when I finally did talk to someone it was helpful. First he armed me with some facts (like dip is way more addictive than cigs and thus harder to quit and at 1+ cans a day I had a serious problem) and then a couple of times I called him as I was literally driving to the quik-e-mart to buy some shit and he talked me off the ledge. That is why I am so psyched about this place. I think that this support is going f*cking save my life (or at least most of my jaw). I do not have any reason to believe I have any type of cancer going on, but sh*t, 36 years of abuse and I am sure that it is just a matter of time. I think I have gained some power over the "nic bitch" (nice phrase y'all use around here) by quitting before some doc tells me I have cancer, etc. This is MY F*CKING quit and I am doing it because I WANT TO and not because someone else is telling or asking me to.

And I want to remember how much it sucks these first few days when you quit...because there is NO F*CKING WAY I WANT TO GO THROUGH THIS AGAIN...so there is no way I am going cave again.

Thanks and peace out....

Hey man... the fog...

Dude, that is brutal. Nicotine suppresses blood oxygen levels. Your brain is reprogrammed to work on less oxygen, and now that the nicotine levels are gone, the oxygen levels are up... and your brain is flooded with good stuff that it needs and deserves but isn't used to getting. Mine lasted almost 50 days. When it passed, it was so wonderful, but living through the fog is a fucking nightmare. We did this to ourselves, so we deserve some pain to reap the rewards ahead. Keep pushing forward, it will pass. But it will take some time.

[4TheWin]

I REALLY appreciate Bulldog and ScottL reading and posting here....hope you guys got my PMs.

Made me feel supported and also your words of wisdom = VERY HELPFUL!

I especially love this quote from Bulldog...."You cannot give the addict brain a single shred of hope that they may be able to "just have one." "

That is so f*cking true. It is probably why I caved so many times in my pre-KTC attempts. I never really acknowledged that I am an addict and that I cannot, ever even have one little taste of that f*cking stuff EVER again...because if I do I will be right back where I was...slave to the can and all the absolute f*cking evil that comes with it.

Thanks!

[Bulldog0311]

Let's start with Sub Topic 3B - what do I think of this site...

Well it is interesting for sure. I am appreciative that someone created something like this...and I appreciate the passion....I am okay with the "my way of the highway" approach too.

On the other hand, I am not exactly thrilled with some of the sh*t going down with my quit group....the vets dominate the posting and seem far more interested in bashing cavers than they do offering support to newbies...which ain't that great...

I do understand the need for cavers to be held accountable, but remember most of us can learn something from each of them (or at least I can)....no matter how lame ass their story is...so the harassment and teasing of cavers doesn't bother me...

But how about some more / better support for guys like me?! (I know I am whining like a f*cking pussy right now....but I am allowed to here, right). I mean I could use some f*cking explanations about how things work and all the secret rules and also site logistics.....plus the flow of the whole DEC 17 quit group thread is already pretty hard to follow (just by roll call posts) and when you add in 100 posts from vets bashing people we don't know and talking about shit that makes no sense...it kinda sucks and it is also hard to form bonds with the others in my group who presumably are those it is most important for me to make a connection with...

And then there is the fact that after a flurry of PMs on day 1, now no one seems all that f*cking interested in me. (I know, maybe I am just a boring-ass human and/or suck-ass post writer) All 8 people that PMed me so far owe me a response, i.e. did not respond to my last PM to them.

In the end, I know this is all on me and in no way does it have any f*cking chance of f*cking up my quit, but still it is kinda annoying and I am going to bitch about it, so there. I will get to work putting myself out there more over the next few days, as I really think I will need the support...but right now I gotta get some f*cking work done...as I am doing an absolute shit@ss job at my job over the last 2 1/2 days.

I wanted to step in on this one. 1389 days quit. I still struggle. I still use my Quit group. I still use my texting buddies. This is lifelong.
I remember the first time I saw some vets lay into a caver. I was like, whoah! Those dudes were harsh. That was uncalled for. Here's the rub tho. You, this new into your Quit, don't understand the addict speak yet. The cavers will use any bullshit addict xcuse to get sympathy and get people off their ass. We know it. We've see it too many times. We know what they say and how they say it.
Fuck. Applejack can usually tell in the first paragraph if someone's gonna quit or cave. And he don't play. He will call you on your bullshit in a heartbeat. He's awesome.
So are they being mean just to be mean? No. Every single one of us wants you quit. That requires truth and honesty on here. Even when it's harsh as fuck. You cannot give the addict brain a single shred of hope that they may be able to "just have one." You have to expose that wound. It's gotta be raw. It's gotta let the infection drain so it can heal. Otherwise your just enabling. This isn't a game man. This methodology is proven. It works. If we don't win that caver or new quitter whose wobbling over there's every chance this addiction will kill them. Dead. This is serious and we want to beat that bitch back and save people's lives.

[scottludwig]

Focus and concentration will be lost when in the fog. B12 complex can help. You ingested a chemically engineered stimulant and fed your addiction, at-will, to keep everything appearing normal. This is why it was always a good time to have a dip: shower dip, after coffee, on the drive in, tucked in your office, after lunch, on the drive home, just one too unwind, last one before bed. Even though you didn't notice the buzz you did as a kid you body and brain knew it was getting its fix. As a quitter, your life and lifestyle will change. No more hiding no more planning its use. I felt very lost but was able to turn the tide by continuing to make my promise first thing in the morning. There is a long road ahead, keep your victories small, hour by hour works just fine. Lean on your group, it will help them along and you will someday know how amazing being free from nicotine truely feels. Good to be quit with you.

[4TheWin]

Let's start with Sub Topic 3B - what do I think of this site...

Well it is interesting for sure. I am appreciative that someone created something like this...and I appreciate the passion....I am okay with the "my way of the highway" approach too.

On the other hand, I am not exactly thrilled with some of the sh*t going down with my quit group....the vets dominate the posting and seem far more interested in bashing cavers than they do offering support to newbies...which ain't that great...

I do understand the need for cavers to be held accountable, but remember most of us can learn something from each of them (or at least I can)....no matter how lame ass their story is...so the harassment and teasing of cavers doesn't bother me...

But how about some more / better support for guys like me?! (I know I am whining like a f*cking pussy right now....but I am allowed to here, right). I mean I could use some f*cking explanations about how things work and all the secret rules and also site logistics.....plus the flow of the whole DEC 17 quit group thread is already pretty hard to follow (just by roll call posts) and when you add in 100 posts from vets bashing people we don't know and talking about shit that makes no sense...it kinda sucks and it is also hard to form bonds with the others in my group who presumably are those it is most important for me to make a connection with...

And then there is the fact that after a flurry of PMs on day 1, now no one seems all that f*cking interested in me. (I know, maybe I am just a boring-ass human and/or suck-ass post writer) All 8 people that PMed me so far owe me a response, i.e. did not respond to my last PM to them.

In the end, I know this is all on me and in no way does it have any f*cking chance of f*cking up my quit, but still it is kinda annoying and I am going to bitch about it, so there. I will get to work putting myself out there more over the next few days, as I really think I will need the support...but right now I gotta get some f*cking work done...as I am doing an absolute shit@ss job at my job over the last 2 1/2 days.

[4TheWin]

Day 3 - I have a lot to say today, but not a lot of time to f*ck around on the site....let's see if I can break it down into sub topics:

A) How am I doing on day 3
B) What do I think of KTC
C) What problems do I see over the next few days that I need to worry about
D) More history and background as far as my intro goes and my thoughts on this whole f*cking thing

One important thing I like....I have never quit before...I have only stopped....but this time I am absolutely quitting because I know that I am a f*cking addict and I cannot even touch this shit...it is poison and it will f*cking take over my life again if I let it...I hate nic with every ounce of my body....and no f*cking way I am caving today.

[4TheWin]

Okay, so last night sucked....woke up like every hour...I would say that it is not really cravings that are getting me at this point, it is just that my brain feels "fuzzy". I am having a hard time concentrating and focusing. So it is like I miss the buzz from the f*cking poison but not that I am really craving it....if that makes any sense. Also, I don't think I am being extra irritable...which unfortunately probably means that I am...so sorry world!

Worked out this AM, which is good, and did not eat anything unhealthy yesterday, which is also good. Have not really seen much info about how exercise helps with quitting, but I bet it does. As for food, we will have to watch that, but as long as I stick to my plan I should be okay.

The smokey mountain stuff is not too bad...at least it is something.

Over the 36 or so years I have been addicted to this horrible sh*t, I cannot say how many times I tried to quit. I can remember at least two periods where I was quit for more than a year. What was it that made me go back after all of that time? I know I am getting ahead of myself with that question, but it does imply that I should probably plan on staying hooked up with this support mechanism (and thank God for it) for a long, long time....like maybe forever. During one of my longest, previous quits, I was helped by calling a 1-800 line that was provided to help stop smoking as part of the Ohio tobacco settlement. They shuffled me around a while since they were highly focused on smoking and did not know much about dip, but when I finally did talk to someone it was helpful. First he armed me with some facts (like dip is way more addictive than cigs and thus harder to quit and at 1+ cans a day I had a serious problem) and then a couple of times I called him as I was literally driving to the quik-e-mart to buy some shit and he talked me off the ledge. That is why I am so psyched about this place. I think that this support is going f*cking save my life (or at least most of my jaw). I do not have any reason to believe I have any type of cancer going on, but sh*t, 36 years of abuse and I am sure that it is just a matter of time. I think I have gained some power over the "nic bitch" (nice phrase y'all use around here) by quitting before some doc tells me I have cancer, etc. This is MY F*CKING quit and I am doing it because I WANT TO and not because someone else is telling or asking me to.

And I want to remember how much it sucks these first few days when you quit...because there is NO F*CKING WAY I WANT TO GO THROUGH THIS AGAIN...so there is no way I am going cave again.

Thanks and peace out....

[4TheWin]

Oh and feel free (anyone) to "jack my thread" anytime....

[4TheWin]

Thanks Worktowin...and sorry about Mizzou...I mean who loses to Purdue by that much? You guys need Gary Pinkel back!

Very true about the contributions of you and others at this place...inspiring and informative. Really a game changer in terms of being able to f*cking really do it this time.

And yes, things suck right now...but I knew what to expect....I am more worried about triggers and temptations that will be coming up in a few weeks....so perhaps I will read up on those today....one f*cking day at a time...

This time I know I go this...because I am really doing it for myself and no-one else....and because I feel like I have support which is awesome

[worktowin]

4thewin, everything said above is so important. Read, read, read. Wake Up, Piss, Post your promise. Do this Every Damn Day and you are on your way to a better life, free from nicotine. Reach out to as many people here as you are comfortable with, then 5 more. Trying to do this with just the site and your promise is tougher than having 20 people waiting on your post and or text every day. Broccoli-Saurus talked a while back about being such an asshole to people who cave that he could never cave. Be like that, have so many people in touch with you daily that the thought of letting them all down is too much to bear. there was member missing from your roll yesterday, and nobody in the group had his/her phone number to reach out and say what the fuck? Answer those PMs in your inbox and get in touch with people daily. Samrs sends out a cheesy joke every day, Miker0351 always has a funny meme/giphy/whatever the hell they call it. Personalize it or just send your daily count, but get involved. My digits will be in your inbox soon as well

You are killing it dude. Love seeing you post with do many groups, supporting so many. And mentoring. You are getting your name out there, and that is keep. Nice work bro.

Sorry I high jacked another dudes thread, but you have written the manual on how you quit here.